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Buffy, Frodo, and the Death Penalty -- luna, hoping this isn't another rerun, 17:41:53 01/12/03 Sun

On a cold winter day in South Carolina, I finally got to see Lord of the Rings (Two Towers). It was wonderful of course-I've loved Tolkien for many years, just gave my son Myth and Middle Earth for his birthday in hopes of soon reading it myself. But as I watched it made me think of several things, some that have come up here recently and some that have not.
First is the reason I saw it without my husband. His favorite TV this weekend was the commutation of the death sentences in Illinois. He loves fantasy-esp. things like The Secret of Roan Inish, but has a growing abhorrence of violence. He really cannot understand how I can enjoy Buffy because all he sees in the parts of the shows he's been willing to watch is violence. I knew from reviews and from the contents of the book that LOTR would be the same for him. So first I'd like to ask how the rest of you think about the violence.
On one hand, my first answer to him is that the violence is obviously fake, esp. on BtVS-her incredible acrobatics, the ease of her victories, the improbability of a small woman tirelessly defeating huge men and monsters, etc. It's symbolic, I tell him. We're not supposed to think about this violence the way we think about the shootings in our town, or the possible war.
Symbolic of what? Well, of course, the eternal battles of good and evil. Just as sex in alchemy or Hindu art is the union of the human and the divine. Just symbolic.
The vampires and monsters in BtVS are so inhuman, and in LOTR the Uruk-hai so hideous. Of course they're not real. But that makes me really wonder about the symbolism of all the mythological movies and TV shows that we see so much of. They give us such an unreal, clear-cut division between good and evil. The incarnations of evil are so clearly that-demons, beasts, not the reality of soldiers who are humans like us, fighting for what we see as good, or even criminals who might have a more complex situation than being undead.
I often teach a book about the death penalty--A Lesson Before Dying. Essentially it's about a man condemned to death and another man whose job is to teach the condemned man that he is human. It seems to me that in war and in the courts, what we do is dehumanize people to allow us to kill them without regret or doubt.
Do shows like BtVs and books and movies like LotR help us to do this? Do they help us teach our children that the enemy is a monster who can be destroyed without regret?
Forgive me if this raises old issues. I'm trying to think it through.

[> Re: Buffy, Frodo, and the Death Penalty -- Corwin of Amber, 18:41:01 01/12/03 Sun

I think what matters is how violence in portrayed. In BTVS, it's usually an unfortunate necessary for Buffy to defend herself or others. LOTR doesn't shy away from the fact that war is an ugly, brutal, heartrending thing, but also suggests that it's sometimes necessary to protect you and yours. It's the shows and movies that portray violence as fun, that glamourize it that are a problem.

[> "Many who live deserve death, and many who die deserve to live . . ." -- HonorH, 18:56:17 01/12/03 Sun

Actually, I'd say just the opposite lesson is learned, when it comes down to it. S6 showed humans, not demons, as the most evil force in Sunnydale. Buffy wasn't willing to kill the Troika or Willow, though, because they were human and because they had a chance to be redeemed, slight as it might be. "You don't kill humans" has been her credo, in spite of the fact that she herself might be something more than human. Faith got careless with human life and used the old "Crime and Punishment" line that an "exceptional" human is held to different standards, and if an "ordinary" human got killed now and again in the line of their Slayer duty, well, sh*t happens, don't it? Buffy saw otherwise. She saw--and sees--her job as the Slayer as being that of protecting humanity, even those who she herself might see as unworthy.

In LotR, Bilbo and Frodo, in turn, take pity on the wretched creature Gollum, though he's twisted, insane, and dangerous. They see him as something that they could very well become under the influence of evil. That gives them compassion, and each of them chooses to spare Gollum's life. Frodo even tries to reach him, to save him.

The whole Ring quest is to save Middle-Earth and keep its peoples free, just as Buffy's job is to keep the humans of Sunnydale alive and free. Helm's Deep is full of women and children when the army of Uruk-Hai marches on it. The defenders are saving their lives and the lives of their families. Just like Buffy only killed Knights of Byzantium when they attacked her and hers. I think a line can be drawn there--that violence is to be avoided, but in exceptional circumstances, when you're defending your life or those you love, it's necessary. It may not be ideal, but that's the way the world is.

[> Tolkein & violence -- Fred the obvious pseudonym, 19:05:28 01/12/03 Sun

Tolkien was an infantry officer in World War I. As such, he probably loathed violence more than any of us here. As he said once, IIRC, "I had ten good friends in 1914. By 1918 eight of them were dead."

He also felt, however, again IIRC, that unilateral foreswearing of violence would do little good; it only makes the task of the vicious & greedy that much easier. So Tolkien's fictional struggles in LOTR are in his construction necessary, but come at a high cost, and are not to be welcomes (save by the foolish or witless.)

[> [> Chesterton Put It Best.... -- BEV, 23:54:03 01/12/03 Sun

"Violence is never the best way of settling your differences, but it is often the only way of not having them settled for you."


Diplomacy as Gandalf points out in the film version of the Fellowship of The Ring, is never going to work on Sauron, a being of pure evil. Gandalf tells Saruman atop Orthanc:

"There is only one Lord of The Ring. Only one who can bend it to his will, and he...does not...share...power."

Similarly with Buffy, either she acts, or the Hellmouth swallows Sunnydale, and presumably the rest of the world with it. The Hellmouth does not share power.


I am a firm believer that violence is often the only recourse we have to defend our freedom. I am wary of extreme positions on either side. Ok, war should not entered into lightly, but also one should never take it off the table as option to prevent greater atrocities.

[> Violence Pants. -- Harry Parachute, having no idea what he just posted., 02:15:56 01/13/03 Mon

I don't get the problem with violence in media and entertainment as much as I used to, and I don't have much issue with it either. I like my entertainment with graphic violence coming out of the pores. I watch disturbing gore-flicks like Evil Dead and Dead Alive. I enjoy video games like Grand Theft Auto: Vice City and Hitman: Silent Assassin...both of which rock, if you're into that sort of thing. I get into some questionable horse-play with my friends while drinking. And when I perform some self-reflection, I don't sense anything chipping away at my humanity.

It's not all that puzzling why we would react to violence in a favourable way. Violence, or physical violence, is just conflict being resolved in the most immediate, intimate, and universal manner. If you're seeing it on television or in the theatre you don't need much of any backstory to get that there's conflict happening, you don't even need to think about it at all. It's a visceral reation, like adrenaline. It's in the blood. We feel conflict through violence. All drama has conflict, so, no surprise that when we're at a young age we do the Cowboys and Indians thing...or Cowboys and Ninjas...which was my contribution to my play-group during recess.

The real question is why do we respond to conflict? It's people in discomfort and pain, any way you look at it. Maybe it's about seeing the good in people when things are at their worst...but ultimately I think that sort of intellectualizing is a load of crap. We get what we want from watching it while watching it, being engrossed in it, so what hooks us isn't higher-brain function but its feeding a need. Now, deeper meaning makes us think about a piece of work later and makes it a classic, granted, but what gets us to stay in our seats is...something else that's a part of us. I don't know what, but I'm guessing it's a dark, primal, nasty, sadistic little monster.

Anyway, more to the point, you could just as easily turn the signified and signifier around and say that all conflict in entertainment that is not violent is in fact symbolic of violence...or actually all conflict is violence that, when not directly physical, is symbolic of it. Someone's always violated and something always violates.

Is that where the word comes from? Violate? If anyone wants to get into semantics, they can go for it.

And hey, why shouldn't we think of the relationship that way? Violence came before story-telling, and we've been using it to restore the statis-quo ever since the black obelisk came to town.

But on the topic of dehumanising in warfare...uh...well...we're always going to do that. We dehumanize our foes in combat. It helps get the job done. It's a natural by-product of you not being me and you threatening me...and the little skeptic in us that says, "Well, that may look like a person, but what proof do you have of its internal state? Actually, who cares? He's armed."

And that sort of unconscious dialogue...the first part of it, anyway...can lead to objectifying your friends and lovers, making them idols of worship or respecting what they embody or...symbolize. *blink* Actualize or symbolize? What is Virtue? Pass the Hemlock.

Point of the matter, our quality to truly relate to others is always strained. T'ain't ever falling like the gentle rain.

...but the Death Penalty...that I support for purposes of practicality. Some people are just severly damaged and deranged beings and are, as far as I'm concerned, inhuman. Ever see any of those HBO interviews with Richard Kiklinski, also known as The Iceman? Here's a remorseless murderer who has brutally killed around 200 people, torturing many of them, without a shred of guilt or disgust. I no longer care about understanding him or getting him to understand he's human. As far as I'm concerned, those things can't be done...because he isn't. His brain doesn't work like a normal person's and nothing can change that. Now, I don't hate him. I don't even really dislike him...he's fairly charasmatic and a funny guy. All the same, we should remove this monster and people like him from the gene pool the same way we'd remove a defective item from the mass market. They're bad for business.

To make a really bold statement, though I currently have the assistance of liquid courage, I sometimes have trouble with our culture's utter revulsion in hurting and killing others and second-guess just how genuine those feelings really are. I doubt it all stems from the noble roots of compassion and understanding, or even the Golden Rule. I think on some level we're afraid of retribution and pain and our own death. The Far East and India have a religion that's based on monism, or at the very least a collective spirit, and that has compassion and understanding as guiding principles. You're still given plenty of room to move when it comes to violence and combat. Look at the Bhagavad-Gita and the Kshatriya caste, or the dueling Samurai and their feudal wars.

So yeah, I don't think the "We are the World" stance is ground enough. The difference between our culture and those cultures that allows them this room to move is the difference between a liberal society and an honor-shame society. We value life and health in itself and fear being deprived of it. They don't...or didn't at any rate.

We see this in the health nuts and the attitude with euthanasia and drug use and suicide...and it's all about doing whatever you can to keep yourself in the game, running from the reaper. Ever been to a funeral and get that really weird sense of nervousness and...dissapointment in the person who died from the others gathered around you? "Poor Bob, he didn't make it."

I mean, what the Hell is with that? What does that statement mean anyway? Are we all perpetually preoccupied with the fear of the shroud, trying to stay one step ahead of it? It's like they were afraid of the body...like Mr. Death was hanging around or just left. That stark elemental terror was there, man...It felt like a bomb-shelter in wartime.

...

...Maybe something has been chipping away at a part of my humanity. At the moment, I think it's the part the controls short term memory.

...

...right, so now I'm lost. Did I hijack?

*sip*

Well, in retrospect this may have crossed some lines...might as well make a "Buffy's a Bitch" post next. I take zero responsibility for my actions.

[> The problem of absolute Evil -- KdS, 03:49:36 01/13/03 Mon

I think that there's a genuine moral problem here that can't be simplistically dealt with by saying "it's all metaphorical". Of course, clear binary good versus evil divisions are good for mythic storytelling, and arguably as part of our moral development we need to recognise the existence of good and evil first before we start greying things up.

I think that Corwin, HonroH, and Fred hit the nail on the head with Tolkein - he could get away with creating absolute Good and Evil because of his feel for human corruptibility and his ability to convey the horrors of war from personal experience (although some critics still feel that he romanticises battle too much). Similarly with BtVS, and I think that the strength of the "Don't kill humans" rule in BtVS is necessary to convey that these are mythic demons and that you shouldn't take away any lesson about the correct way of dealing with human deviancy in the real world. (Of course, this then leads to problems with politicised readings where demons and vamps are seen as representing the real-world socially excluded.)

The problem comes with the less talented fantasy and action writers who portray battles between absolute Good and Evil without such care in writing, in away that can come across very easily as conducive to the dehumanisation of human enemies. (If I may wax controversial, one can only take a look at Ronald Reagan's Star Wars-inspired Evil Empire speech as an example. See also the famous "independent contractors" discussion in Kevin Smith's film Clerks.)

Pretty much the ultimate attack on this for those of you with strong stomachs, is a novel called The Iron Dream by Norman Spinrad. Spinrad was an SF writer who had exactly the same moral qualms about Good-vs.-Evil stories as you do, and was roused to protest in particular by his revulsion for Heinlein's novel Starship Troopers. This comes dangerously close to explicitly endorsing genocidal warfare as a Good Thing, on the basis of (a grotesquely oversimplified understanding of) Darwinian evolutionary theory. The Iron Dream is presented as an SF novel written in an alternate universe by Adolf Hitler. In this universe, Hitler fled to the US after the failure of the Beer Hall Putsch (1923 IIRC), gave up active politics, and became a pulp SF writer. The book shows a stereotyped iron-willed fantasy hero taking over the only pure-bred nation in a mutation-riddled post-Holocaust world and launching a holy war for the future of humanity. All this is presented with a total faith in the hero's moral righteousness, a purpleness of prose, and a relish for explicit brutality that are only slightly exaggerated from the type of book being parodied. The black irony comes from the reader's realisation, at a point that will depend on his or her historical knowledge, that the action of the book parallels an idealised version of the rise of Nazism in Germany, the Second World War, and the Holocaust - idealised from the Nazi point of view! Spinrad even gives the book a "happy ending" in which the Heldenites (his proxy for Nazi Germany) conquer the world, exterminate all other sentient life, and launch a space programme to conquer the stars.

One can question the morality of Spinrad's actions, and the effect of the book on some hypothetically ignorant reader who reached the end without "getting it", but one can't deny the novel's power. Certainly if you read it, and if the violence and the concept don't utterly repel you, you'll look at an awful lot of heroic fantasy and hero mythology in a cooler and more critical light, and with a greater understanding of its potential for misuse.

[> [> that's what I meant--and also see Simple to Pogo, above -- luna, 14:33:38 01/13/03 Mon

Thanks, KdS, for clarifying. I shouldn't have lumped in the death penalty and violence for kiddies--leads to too many side arguments. The real problem I sensed with Tolkien, and not when I first read him, and now with Buffy is exactly that. By setting up a category of creature that can be destroyed with impunity, without trial or consideration of each individual case, we create a pattern for sick thinking.

In Little Bit's great summary of the evils in S4, she points out how the Initiative didn't bother with refinements in targeting non-humans, but just destroyed them all. Buffy doesn't always do this--as several pointed out, there are some notable exceptions, but still, if we see a vampire climbing out of a grave, we don't expect Buffy to interview him about his intentions before she whips out the stake.

[> [> [> The problems of simplification (spoilers: All Quiet on the Western Front, CWDP, Selfless) -- Fred the obvious pseudonym, 15:52:40 01/13/03 Mon

What Luna described is part of the problem & tragedy.

Part of all wars is violent oversimplification. The guys in the other suits are the Enemy; you "have" to kill them not for their nature as individuals, but because they are part of an Other that your government (or tribal leaders, or whatever) has designated as "bad."

This was, of course, perhaps best encapsulated in Erich Maria Remarque's "All Quiet on the Western Front." His protagonist, Paul, a German soldier, stumbles into a confrontation with a Frenchman. Paul stabs him, but is compelled by danger -- artillery fire, we don't know whether it's "his" or "theirs" -- to remain in the shellhole with the dying French soldier. As a result Paul determines that his "enemy" is a real person (and not a bad guy.) In the end, he can do nothing for him and this hapless Frenchman dies -- from the wound he suffered at Paul's hand. And Paul grieves.

Buffy, acting as a combatant for the Powers that Be (or the Watcher's Council -- they're not identical, although the Council may believe so) has to face numerous "opponents". She may not have the luxury of being able to determine if any of the vampires she stakes are redeemable. If, say, she is fighting four freshly-awakened vampires in the cemetary, can she say in the midst of the fray "You three will only be evil and kill people; Number Four, you may be like Spike and can become -- or be turned into -- a harmless individual vampire. So I'll spare you." Time and danger work against this. Almost by mathematics people who are in a war -- and Buffy is -- HAVE to establish categories (not-a-target, target) and oversimplify. Otherwise they cannot defend the innocent.

[I do not intend a facile defense of his process; of course, it is often unjustifiable. The Nazis, for example, set up categories for death and consciously de-humanized their victims to make the task of killing them easier. Plenty of other examples exist where this defining of the "other" leads to atrocity.]

You can be moral, and decent, and wind up dead if you hesitate in combat. You may not only sacrifice yourself but other people that you KNOW are innocent (at least not deserving of death.) What choice do you have?

Buffy has made choices. She has decided NOT to kill some of the identified "others" that her figures of authority want her to kill. She has spared Angel, and Spike and Clem and others who have given her indications that they are harmless or at least offer possibilities for redemption. But she has had to know them first. Even Holden "Webs" Webster (CWDP) is spared when he starts talking. Buffy goes after Anya only after the latter has started to kill again as a vengeance demon (Selfless.)

When she has a choice she makes a choice. Many times, however, in this ongoing conflict in which she is immersed circumstances preclude the option of choice. She has to balance morality with her own needs of survival, and the needs of survival of the people whom she is protecting. In the Buffyverse, with few exceptions, vampires = death to innocents.

So she kills them.

While Luna may see this process as setting up a category of "creature" that may be killed with impunity, there are, within not only the Jossverse but other tales about vampires, these reasons for Buffy to act in this way. If vampires did NOT kill, then the issue would be different. I believe that there is a series of fantasy fiction (I forget the author) that supposes that vampires come to exist and are integrated into human society. Those that do not kill or take blood from the unwilling have full protection under the law; those that do are targets of hunters.

The category, "vampire = target," was not invented, but to some degree explored, by ME. Perhaps they should do more to make this issue murky -- but to some degree (Angel, Spike, even Harmony) they have. Buffy has moved to the point of MOST vampires she kills on sight; some that have given her evidence of redeemability she has not. But the presupposition is still "vampire = target."

An autobiography I read years ago comes to mind. The writer was an American woman living in Japan during World War II (she married a Japanese national.) One of her neighbors had lost a son in the war. To the Americans who killed him he was a kamikaze pilot trying to bring them a fiery death. To his mother he was still the happy little boy who liked to catch butterflies. Both roles were true.

But even if the Americans on the gun crew that shot him had known of his other role, as a mother's son, could they have done differently?

[> [> [> [> Actually, I think Buffy helps stop simplification in real life. . . -- Finn Mac Cool, 16:15:47 01/13/03 Mon

Some people have said that the division on Buffy between killable and non-killable creatures is problematic, given the thinking people take sometimes that people who are different are almost unhuman, like the demons on Buffy.

However, I would propose a different way of looking at it. The demons on Buffy look nothing like human beings, and, while some act human, those aren't the ones Buffy kills. Joss Whedon also once said that the reason they had vampires shift into a "game-face" when they get angry or hungry is to emphasize that Buffy was slaying inhuman monsters, not people.

I think this actually works against people simplifying the enemy into the "killable creature" category, because in real life nobody looks like the demons on Buffy, or the vampires (as long as they're in their game face, and I don't think Buffy's ever killed one who wasn't). So, when they come face to face with someone designated as Other, they aren't as willing to kill them because they look nothing like the image of evil creatures they've been presented with.

The genre that could be said to have this simplification problem is the non-fantasy action genre. Take "Die Hard" for example. John McClane is noticeably disturbed when the terrorists/thieves kill someone, but expresses no remorse or regret when he kills a terrorist himself. He even uses one dead terrorist's blood to write "Now I have a machine gun. Ho Ho Ho" on the corpse. The terrorists, while they are fully human, are treated no better than vampires are on Buffy. Buffy, however, is fantasy-action, where human life is not so casually taken, and the only casual killing is that of demonic creatures that nothing alive on earth bears resemblance to.

[> "The Uses of Enchantment"... -- Sofdog, 08:33:23 01/13/03 Mon

..is a wonderful book by Bruno Bettelheim that explores the various categories of fairy stories and their importance to teaching morality and courage.

You might find some leads there.

[> [> Re: "The Uses of Enchantment"... -- luna, 14:36:46 01/13/03 Mon

Thanks, Sofdog, I do really like that book. I understand what he says about dealing with children's natural and real feelings and impulses, and I didn't really mean to get into the argument that media violence leads to violence.

I was thinking more in political terms, about creating categories of people who are not people. I see that I wasn't clear.

[> [> [> People who are not people -- Rahael, 06:39:37 01/14/03 Tue

Luna, I tend to post a lot about this. In fact I think it's the way that ME deals with this issue which lead me to love Buffy so much, and the theme which speaks most strongly to me.

BtVS handling on this issue speaks to me on a metaphorical level, on a practical level and on an emotional level.

Because I've talked about this so much I tend to find myself repeating myself, so I'm trying not to do that. I'll approach it more elliptically.

What constitutes the human in the Buffyverse?

I think from the very first episode, Buffy has been 'gray' - though I think that word is reductive. I like to say that Buffy is full of colour. And I think it has approached it very subtely and all the more powerfully for that. From the first, BtVS makes us ask "what is human? what is monster?" It reverses our expections so many times that the net effect is to question the nature of humanity. The examination of 'evil humanity' in S6 is not a sharp turn, but the fullest expression of a consistent and underlying theme.

In a metaphorical sense Buffy does not concern herself with 'crimefighting', nor with 'human wars'. She concerns herself with the explicitly emotional terrain, as Slain has pointed out. The point about Vampires is not that they look so different from us, but they look just like us. Buffy never thinks "ooh, Vampire" when she meets Angel for the first time. In fact, it is explicitly pointed out to us that Buffy cannot 'sense' Vamps, though she does spot one by his out of date fashion. Which also points out to us that these are people frozen in time. Trapped. Combined with the fact that the point ME keeps ramming home is change - in the shape of death, of mortality, of time passing - always in ironic contrast to these unaging Vampires. In nearly every ep, we get to see Buffy walking in a graveyard, a graphic depiction of our most painful truth - we, the viewers, the characters, the writers - we will all find our end there. The Vampires are both an expression of human wish-fulfillment, and its terrible consequences. The ultimate lesson is that we should always face the truth, and accept the 'only end of age'.

Demonising the Other

I think I've gone into minute detail about why I do not think that Vamps are coded as ethnic minorities, so I'll leave that by this time.

But I wanted to talk about how people deny the humanity of their enemy in order to kill them, which was your main point anyway. I think there is a very big difference between 'demons' in the Buffyverse and 'Vampires' in the Buffyverse. I think demons in both AtS and BtVS are portrayed quite differently, and Buffy is not a demon slayer. I'd just like to point to 'Earshot', 'A New Man' and the whole Anya Arc post S3 and move on to the main point. Vampires are not just former people (people who have lost their humanity) they are dead people. And in that sense they deal with one of the most ever constant themes of human culture - the boundaries between death and life, and those who walk on those boundaries. I think the the handling and importance of this issue has only been more clearly highlighted since Season 6, but it's always been there, since after all, Buffy has been on that threshold since the end of Season 1, an event which we know that Joss always planned for. The whole point about both of Buffy's deaths is that *she came back to life*. She's completely other.

I read with much interest ZM's post about Buffy as a monster. What I felt was: why do we call bad human beings monsters in the Buffyverse? This idea is made absolutely meaningless by the presence of 'monsters' like Clem - i.e, in the Buffyverse, to call someone a 'monster' says almost nothing about their actions. To call Buffy a human who has done a terrible wrong - doesn't this have the hugest weight? Isn't this the most serious accusation? And don't these two complementary ideas tell us something about how subtly and powerfully BtVS attacks the demonisation of human enemies?

To end, I'd just go off topic to say something about real life, and the demonisation of the enemy. In my experience the people who do this best are the people who don't like humanity, don't respect human life, and don't have a fundamental respect for their fellow man. They are the people who can shrug in the face of the inescapable evidence of the possesion of humanity in their victims. They don't need to lie to themselves, they just don't care. I learnt this as a child. How could an army soldier pretend that a child of 6 was a demon, not a human? When the child cowered and wept in front of his gun? We excuse evil by saying that it believes that the enemy isn't human.

I have been lucky to meet people whose fundamental respect for other human beings just shine out of them. They have moral standards, and they do use the right to condemn injustice, but they never lose or degrade the integrity of this notion. And it's not words, its just this indefinable quality. More than anything else in the world, I know that it is this quality that I must cultivate and exercise in myself, because it's the surest defence against the injustice and cruelty of the world, and falling into the trap of committing great wrongs. When I meet people who possess this - I try and keep them in my life.

I think it is this respect that BtVS tries to engender.

The most scary people I've ever come into contact with are those who believe other human beings are expendable. They don't even value life, to be honest. They keep banging on and on about glorious deaths for the homeland. About how the finest achievement of any citizen is to *die* for an empty and bloody ideal. And if you don't share that ideal? They are very happy to thrust martyrdom and glory on you. I'd point out that those who 'demonise' the enemy don't care all that much for the lives of 'their own'. They just don't care about humanity full stop.

Buffy never stops caring for humanity.

[> [> [> [> Slight correction (and well known S6 Spoiler in above post) -- Rahael, 06:52:31 01/14/03 Tue

When I said this:

"I think from the very first episode, Buffy has been 'gray' - though I think that word is reductive. I like to say that Buffy is full of colour. And I think it has approached it very subtely and all the more powerfully for that. From the first, BtVS makes us ask "what is human? what is monster?" It reverses our expections so many times that the net effect is to question the nature of humanity. The examination of 'evil humanity' in S6 is not a sharp turn, but the fullest expression of a consistent and underlying theme."

the better word would have been to say is Buffy investigates the nature of humanity. The end point of this investigation is engendering respect for humanity, even in all its frailties and faults and the terrible 'inhumane' things that we do.

[> [> [> [> [> Beautifully said. -- Sophist, 08:34:16 01/14/03 Tue


[> [> [> [> [> Agreeing with Sophist. Lovely post, Rahael. -- Ixchel, 12:24:08 01/14/03 Tue


[> Re: Buffy, Frodo, and the Death Penalty -- Q, 19:17:38 01/13/03 Mon

I have always been strongly opposed to capital punishment. One of the things I admired about Buffy from WAY far back was the way I could take my own views away from the show.

Re-watch "I Only Have Eyes For You" to see where the soul of the show is on the subject. I loved Xander's line when Buffy said James should pay for killing Grace-- "With his life?", and Buffy responds "No...".

Jump to season 6, and how Willows killing of Warren was handled. Though several of the scoobies had a hard time not condemning Warren to death, the consensus soon became obvious... that even though Warren may have deserved death... It was not for them to be the judge of something so final, and they didn't deserve to be the ones to have to do it.

Strong messages *against* violence and Capital punishment in my opinion.

Look over at "Angel". One of the *Central* themes is the destroying power of vengeance. Look at what it did to Holtz. As capital punishment is nothing but state santioned vengeance, this fits in well too. There are MANY moral plays on the darkness of vengeance on Angel.

My favorite part of Lord of the Rings, in in the book "The Fellowship of the Ring". The fellowship is in the tunnels beneath the Misty Mountains, and Frodo broaches the idea of killing Gollum. Gandalf rebukes this idea, saying pretty much that people are not to judge when someone else should die, regardless of what that person has done. Every man has a destiny, and to take that destiny prematurely could be the biggest sin of all. As we who have read the book know, this was a HUGE conversation in the book because of the destiny in question.

I think these are real good lessons, because they point out my main problems with the death penalty. 1) Even though a man may "deserve" death-- we as taxpayers do not deserve to be made killers. 2) Who can possibly be the judge of something so final as death? 3) If a mans destiny is to find redemption and some sort of light after a youthful light of such evil, can there be *any* morality in preventing him from reaching his destiny?

I love these shows because the are RIPE with gems of morality, even when heavily buried in metaphor and symbolism.

[> [> Vengeance and Violence -- Buffyboy, 03:11:39 01/14/03 Tue

Whatever types of violence BtVS and AtS do condone, and they clearly do condone and even praise some forms of violence, in almost every case vengeance is unequivocally condemned. Just this evening I watched The Wish on my new Season3 DVDs (they just arrived yesterday after their tour of seven states in the US en route from Nevada to California thanks to UPS-- I'm tempted to swear eternal vengeance on all things brown). Not only is The Wish a wonderful episode in general but a delightful/horrifying portrayal of the unintended consequences of vengeance. And The Wish is far from the only example I could site: from the gypsy tribe's absolutely irrational curse of Angel, to EvilWillow's fraying of Warren, to Holtz' centuries long quest for vengeance against Angel, to all the in and outs of the vengeance demon story arcs, no serious act of vengeance has gone unexamined and its true insanity not revealed.

Yet American society itself is rife with vengeance. From gang violence to corporate competition to capital punishment to the idea of Hell, vengeance is often the order of the day. Look at the murder rate in Oakland, CA over the last year and the vengeance that has contributed so greatly to it. Look at what so many corporate executives say and do about their competition (recall that Bill Gates, in those internal e-mails that came out of the Microsoft Anti-Trust trial, all but swore eternal vengeance against Netscape and other companies that he felt where stealing Microsoft's market share). Look at the reaction of so many to Governor Ryan's recent commuting of the death sentences in Illinois. Governor Ryan is seen by many as having betrayed the victim's families in their legitimate demand for vengeance as necessary in order to bring about "closure". Look at the idea of Hell as the ultimate vengeance inflicted upon the wicked.

Western fiction too has often fallen under the spell of the desire for vengeance. From the Iliad to Death Wish and its countless imitators, vengeance as been celebrated as a heroic individual's highest calling. Yet, there is an important alternative perspective in Western fiction as well, the remarkable chapter on feuding in Mark Twain's Huckleberry Finn comes to mind. Both BtVS and AtS come down hard on Twain's side. For their handling of the violence that results from vengeance Me deserves the highest praise.

Great article on Daniel Dae Kim (JadeMagazine.com) -- neaux, 18:14:04 01/12/03 Sun

While I'm not your typical Asian woman, I am in fact a caucasian male married to a Korean woman. So I wont feel so out of place recommending this website.

please read this article on Daniel!! He rules Angel! and the article is spoiler free..

link

[> Re: Great article on Daniel Dae Kim (JadeMagazine.com) -- JM, 18:30:33 01/12/03 Sun

Thanks, neaux. He sounds like a great guy. He's right about those romantic comedies being a watershed mark. And some of what he said about putting food on the table or funding the off-broadway play tracks to what people were discussing about our Scoobs movie roles so far not being very distinguished. I'm one of the few who seem to enjoy Gavin and find him a good foil for Lilah. Could two evil lawyers be more different?

[> [> And here I was thinking I was the only person who liked Gavin! -- KdS, 02:45:35 01/13/03 Mon

Gavin's the most underrated character on Angel, but I think he'd like it that way. His bureaucratic attack on AI in early S3 could have really done them some damage, but Lilah sabotaged it because it wasn't her idea and because it wasn't melodramatic enough for her.

I think Gavin knows exactly what he's doing - he's the quietly indispensable henchman who'll still be alive and in the Senior Partners' good books when a hundred charismatic heads of Special Projects have been beheaded or taken out by Champions of Good.

[> [> [> I hope you're right... -- Masq, 09:40:03 01/13/03 Mon

"I think Gavin knows exactly what he's doing - he's the quietly indispensable henchman who'll still be alive and in the Senior Partners' good books when a hundred charismatic heads of Special Projects have been beheaded or taken out by Champions of Good."

I hope you're right, because I'm wondering if the role of Gavin isn't one of those bad-guy roles that Kim doesn't relish. I mean, so far, Gavin has just been a schmuck, whose sole purpose seems to be getting batted around by Lilah and Angel like a cat-toy.

I do like D.D. Kim, though, since he did a guest star appearance on ST: Voyager as an astronaut from that planet with the speeded-up time.

[> [> I've always been a Gavin fan -- Vickie, 10:55:31 01/13/03 Mon

I enjoyed Kim in his AtS outings. Cool and business-oriented evil is a nice foil for Lilah's over-the-top approach.

I loved Kim in Crusade, too. There, he played one of the first telepaths allowed to serve in the military. Lots of pressure on the character. Too bad the show was cancelled before there was much development.

[> Thanks neaux -- Rufus, 22:59:25 01/12/03 Sun

It's now over on the Trollop Board as well.

[> [> very cool. Its always good to hear about the Angel crew -- neaux, 07:02:11 01/13/03 Mon


Evolution of Evil in the BuffyVerse from Simple Evil to Pogo, Part Four (1 of 2) -- LittleBit (who has money on this being archived before noon), 21:31:54 01/12/03 Sun

Evolution of Evil in the BuffyVerse from Simple Evil to Pogo, Part Four

[Preface: to avoid misunderstanding of the terms as I am choosing to use them, the Big Bad is the one who drives the season an the story arc; little bads are anyone/anything else, regardless of their degree of 'badness'.]

Season 4 evil comes from a federal government level conspiracy.

The BIG BAD

The Initiative and Adam


First there was the Initiative, an organization whose purpose was to capture the 'bad' creatures (vampires, demons, werewolves, and so on, also known as Hostile Sub-Terrestrials or HSTs) and attempt to render them harmless to human society. Unfortunately, in order to do this value judgments were not possible, there was no allowance for the possibility that anything (not anyone) non-human could be other than an animal, and therefore human standards governing interaction could be discarded. Experiments of all types were carried out with callous disregard and less regulation than legitimate animal research is granted. The entire operation is carried out clandestinely, underground. Not only were their prisoners tested to help determine that which might neutralize them, but also to see what stimuli would cause the demonic defenses to manifest and also, and most telling, to what use humans might put these defenses.
Unbeknownst to the vast majority of the members of the Initiative, there were other sets of experiments being performed. These experiments were not being conducted on the vampires, demons and monsters. They were being performed with the special ops commandos as the unwitting test subjects. Experiments that included supplements to increase strength, endurance and overall performance. When Professor Walsh was killed the schedules for their meds was thrown off, and the guys began to undergo withdrawal. Dr. Angleman and other scientists are aware of the issue and attempt to bring the guys in to get them back on an even keel. Of all the operatives, Riley has been the prime experiment, their showcase. Adam tells him that Maggie has shaped him, formed him, taught him how to think and feel, made his mind and body stronger. Adam is not entirely wrong. Riley, and the rest of the special ops teams have been carefully programmed to follow orders without questions, do their job well and responsibly and they will be rewarded for it. Riley remains with the Initiative until he realizes that they are every bit as hidebound, inflexible and callous as Buffy has described them when they are experimenting on a werewolf and it undergoes metamorphosis into Oz, a human whom Riley knows. When he protests at the treatment of Oz, Riley is removed from the room. When he attempts to free Oz, Riley is taken into custody for a court martial hearing. During the Scoobies' attempt to rescue Oz, they learn that Riley is also a prisoner, and free him as well. This act signifies Riley's final severance of the ties to the Initiative. What Riley didn't know at the time was that behavior modifier microchips were not for HSTs only - one had been implanted in him as well. When activated he is unable to disobey an order. During Buffy's battle with Forrest, on Adam's orders, Riley is able to secure a piece of broken glass, and possessing just enough free will to move in small amounts, uses it to cut the chip out of his chest. He is then free to take on Forrest/demon/cyborg freeing Buffy to go after Adam.
The Initiative operatives, and Riley specifically, overstate the degree to which the chip affects Spike when he says that Hostile 17 is unable to harm any living thing. Either he overestimates the chip's functionality, or he grossly underestimates the variety of life that should come under the heading of 'living things.' According to a very broad application of this definition Spike should be unable to walk on the grass without pain; he should be unable to attempt to kill any animals, including rats; and he very definitely should be unable to harm other demons because relatively few of them are dead/undead. It would be in character for the Initiative to dismiss anything other than human life in their definition of 'any living thing', however, and their prejudices in this area are shown many times throughout the season. Interestingly enough, for many of the members of the Initiative, this contempt extends to some extent to both women and civilians who are outside their group. This disregard costs the lives of many of the soldiers and scientists.

The other human experiment, Adam is a kinematically redundant, biomechanical demonoid... In addition to organic material, he's equipped with GP-2/D-11 Infrared Detectors. A Harmonic Decelerator, plus DC Servo. Pieced together from parts of other demons. And man. And machine. Adam uses the data about him to learn what he is, but being sentient he wants to know who he is as well. Adam knows his purpose ... he was created to kill. He himself says that he has a design flaw, and it appears that the flaw lies in the lack of boundaries to that directive - he has accepted his responsibility to extinguish life wherever he finds it. He is learning about the world, learning how things work, what the flaws are in other creatures. When reality is altered by Jonathan's spell, Adam is undeceived by it, albeit willing to wait and study the chaos that he believes will ensue because of the spell. He charismatically begins to round up the demons, monsters and vampires, uniting them as they have never been willing to unite before. Adam recruits Spike to assist in assuring that the Slayer plays the part he has designed for her by promising to remove the chip from his head once he had fulfilled his part of the bargain. Adam makes this promise in several ways, some of which leave themselves open to interpretation: "I will restore you to what you once were." He has killed Maggie Walsh and Dr. Angleman and reanimated them as mindless zombies; Forrest was also killed by him, but in his case he is turned into a demon/cyborg like Adam. In the end, Adam orders Forrest to take Spike's head off as the method for removing the chip because Spike had failed to deliver what he promised: a Slayer, alone, disenfranchised from her companions, ready to inflict maximum carnage on the demons held by the Initiative. Buffy is indeed there, but with the Scoobies, and a plan to inflict maximum damage, but on a single target: Adam. When Buffy seeks him out, Adam delays her by ordering Forrest to kill her, a gleefully accepted order. Buffy is detained until Riley frees himself and steps in. Buffy then follows Adam, and with the assistance of her friends and a joining of their abilities coupled with the essence of the power of the Slayer lineage, they defeat Adam by removing his power source.

Orders and regulations were necessary to maintain discipline within the Initiative. Questions regarding the purpose behind the organization were discouraged quite firmly, as was independent thinking, and information was disseminated on a need-to-know basis only. The Initiative had vast scientific and military resources at its disposal but these were applied only within the framework of its objectives. The Initiative ultimately failed because it's own structure prevented growth, did not allow for the possibility that there was more to the project than the military portion knew, prevented the flexibility needed to deal with its own mistakes (Adam) and it was destroyed by those mistakes.

VAMPIRE
Sunday & the campus vamps bring an old story to a new setting. They have been preying on college students, generally new Freshmen, for quite some time. Sunday has, as is expected, her minions who are more entertaining than some but still pretty much not the best and brightest. Sunday does achieve, for a short while, something that few other vampires have accomplished: she has the Slayer off-balance and slightly afraid of her. Most of this, however is due to Buffy apprehension about all the changes in her life, and the emotional upheaval that comes with it. This is one of the first times when we are shown that Buffy's Slayer abilities and skills are affected by her emotional state - when Buffy feels unsure and defeated her fighting skills seem to be less effective as well. Once Buffy is emotionally ready to deal with all of it she eliminates the nest fairly quickly. Buffy does have two individuals to thank for this. First ... Xander, who lets Buffy know that she is still the competent Slayer, the hero as it were. And secondly, Sunday herself, who makes the mistake of getting Buffy angry; and anger always boosts her strength and determination.

Spike (aka 'Hostile 17) returns to Sunnydale with the intention of ridding the world of the current Slayer. He is instead almost immediately captured by the Initiative who use him for their experiments. In particular, they implant a chip in his head that gives him blinding pain whenever he attempts to harm a human. As a result of the chip, Spike finds himself starving, and appeals to a most unexpected source for assistance - the Slayer herself. Buffy very reluctantly assists him, only because he says he has information about the Initiative. They become very strange allies, with Spike's greatest frustration being that he cannot to convince the Scoobies that he is still evil; and the Scoobies keep forgetting that his assistance is quite conditional. His happiest moment seemed to come when he realized that he was not completely helpless, that he could indeed hurt other demons without the resultant pain. At that point he helped the Scoobies with great enthusiasm, just for the fun and exhilaration of the fight. Spike teams up with Adam, the demon/cyborg to help him kill the Slayer, but in the very end Spike assists the Slayer, primarily because he sees that the Slayer and the Scoobies are the winning side. We see that Spike, for all his talk, is actually a very social creature in that he feels the need to 'belong' somewhere. He was a member of the Fanged Four before Angel's re-souling broke the group apart, and then as long as he had Dru, or even Harmony, he had the interpersonal contact he craved. With the chip, he found himself excluded from the society of other vampires, and of course looked down upon by other demons. He then attached himself to the Scooby Gang, whether they liked it or not, at times using the antagonism as a means to assure that he would not be ignored by them.

We learn what happened to Harmony during the fight at Graduation. We had last seen her being bitten, and now find out that she was indeed turned. As vampires go she provides a greater degree of comic relief than any others we've seen so far. She remains just as shallow, just as whiny and sulky, just as much a pain as she was when she was alive. We do learn, to our collective amazement, that she is Spike's girlfriend. We also see that one other thing hasn't changed much - Harmony will take a great deal of abuse in order to maintain a false sense of self esteem. In high school, she was ecstatic to find out that a really cool guy was thinking of asking her to the prom if the other girls on his list ahead of her weren't available. With Spike she is clearly not his priority, but goes along with his moods as though it is all she deserves. Harmony is the catalyst for one of the high comic moments of the season, when she and Xander argue and it degenerates into a slappy / hair-pulling, very girly type of fight. It is never quite clear why Buffy never staked Harmony. This is a case of Harmony à vampire, Buffy à Slayer; her duty is clear, but Buffy never seems to be able to take Harmony seriously enough to see her as a menace. Why is inexplicable: if the very fact that Harmony is a healthy, well-fed vampire who is not very likely buying pig's blood from the butcher wasn't enough, then it should have become obvious when she kidnapped and held Dawn hostage, and lost control of her minions who were just about to feed on Dawn when Buffy rescued her.

The Boone and the boys are vampires recruited by Adam. They are swayed by Adam's arguments that they live in fear of death, in fear of light, in fear of god. They willingly take on the role of Adam's heralds. They face that fear by publicly and in the daytime confronting and confining a church congregation during the Sunday service. What they didn't take into account was that while, yes, they did indeed fear those things on a psychological basis, they also feared the Slayer on a very physical basis. When they put their fears aside, they put all their fears aside, believing that the empowerment Adam made them feel gave them the strength to win over her. It didn't, however, give him the ability to face two Slayers. What Boone and his companions showed Adam was that it was possible for him to dominate and command the vampires. And that his plan to unite the demons needed to also include the Slayer.

DEMONS

Buffy's first roommate, Kathy initially seems to be simply the 'roommate from hell' that one always seems to know about. Kathy is perky and very organized, immediately setting out the rules for the room, and decorating with choices that show her to be very mainstream in her likes, not the sort of person who would have spent evenings at a club like the Bronze listening to local bands, but would have all the top ten albums from the pop music list. Kathy also expected that by being roommates, she and Buffy would be automatic 'best friends,' hanging out together and such. Buffy, on the other hand, took an instant dislike to her perky and impervious roommate, visibly showing her reluctance to hang around, or share her friends in any way. It doesn't help when Kathy attaches herself during Buffy's patrol and then blames Buffy for making a mess of her clothes. They both get extremely territorial and adversarial, deliberately doing things for no other reason than to get on the other's nerves. Everyone thinks that Buffy is simply overreacting to having to share her living space for the first time, and go so far as to decide she's dangerous to Kathy, which results in her being ambushed by Giles, Xander and Oz, and tied up so she can come to her senses. Meanwhile, Giles did at least listen to Buffy's "proof" and confirms that Kathy's toenail clippings are still growing, which means that Buffy is right, and Kathy is a demon, a Mok'tagar Demon as it turns out who was performing a ritual to steal Buffy's soul. She has runaway from her dimension and taken on a human guise because she wants to go to college. Unfortunately, she ended up with the one roommate who could bust her, even as she was stealing the soul so that Buffy would have been mistaken for her when her people came after her, except that Giles performed the reversing ritual just in time, and it's Kathy who is taken home. Buffy is then free to room with Willow (who did have the legendary 'roommate from hell).

Tapparich is Kathy's Mok'tagar Demon daddy, who comes to take her home once his henchmen have located her. He's interesting in that he's shown to be a very cliché father, demon or no, who isn't willing to listen to his daughter (even though she's 3000 already) because he simply knows best.

Gachnar is inadvertently called when a serendipitous series of events happen to complete the ritual invocation. He has great power over humans, using their fears to control them. We are given an insight into the fears of each of the Scoobies. Xander fears that he is invisible to the group, and to Buffy in specific. Willow fears that Buffy is dismissive of her suggestions and doesn't respect her growing power as a witch, and also is more distressed when Oz leaves her alone for her own safety. Oz fears that he will lose any control over the werewolf part of himself becoming a menace to those he cares about. Gachnar feeds Buffy's fear of abandonment, that every time she cares she'll be deserted. And, od course, Anya reveals her fear of bunnies without the assistance of Gachnar. When Gachnar is finally released and manifests, he is seen to be an itty-bitty Fear Demon, about six inches tall, and his power over them is broken by his own insignificance. It is interesting in retrospect to look at each of their fears. Xander feared that he was nothing to them, and yet he has always retained his position in the group. Oz feared that he would lose control of the werewolf within, and yet he was able to prevent his fear from fully manifesting that night, and also eventually gained the ability to control the emergence of the werewolf during the full moon. However, the second part of his fear turned out to be entirely justified - even when he had learned control over the wolf, he could lose it when it came to those he cared about. Willow feared that Buffy didn't respect her abilities as a leader or as a witch. As it turned out, Willow was the one who failed to give her abilities the respect they deserved. Her fears about Oz abandoning her however, were realized sooner than anyone thought they might be. Buffy's fears that she would be deserted by those she cared about were justified ... with her father's absence and Angel leaving for her own good, and even Parker's smarminess, it did begin to seem that if she allowed herself to care her reward would be heartache.

D'Hoffryn gave us a glimpse into an area of demonic activity that we were first shown when Anya attempted to get her vengeance demon status back. D'Hoffryn appears this season to recruit Willow for that very purpose after she shows her talent for creating mayhem in the name of vengeance, even though she doesn't realize she's doing it. When she refuses and insists on being sent back to fix things, he gives her his talisman with instructions to use it should she ever change her mind. With D'Hoffryn we see the recruiting of humans to become a specific type of demon, who then preys on human frailties.

The Vahral Demons were initially encountered by Buffy and then Riley who lets it get away but sets the Initiative guys after it. Apparently these demons were ones who inspired those who wrote about them to wax poetic, for the descriptions that the Scoobies find in their research are "Slick like gold and gird in moonlight, father of portents and brother to blight" and "Limbs with talons, eyes like knives, bane to the blameless, thief of lives." They were found digging up the bones of a child, which is a part of a ritual that uses the blood of a man, the bones of a child and the Word of Valios, in the sacrifice of three. They go looking for the Word while Giles continues researching. As he learns what the Word is he is attacked by the three demons, and the Word, which is a talisman that was in Giles unsuspecting possession, is taken completing the items needed for the ritual. Giles also learned that the purpose of the ritual was to open the Hellmouth. During the fight at the Hellmouth it is Xander who realizes that the demons themselves are the sacrifice, and Spike who finds he can hit the demons without pain. As Xander and Willow are escaping with Spike Riley comes in and shows he is well-trained to follow commands, immediately following Buffy's instruction to keep the final demon from sacrificing itself. Unfortunately a distraction allows the demon to jump in, but Buffy follows after Riley attaches a lifeline to her so he can be certain she comes back out. Buffy is able to drag the final demon out, preventing the completion of the ritual. We never do learn anything more about them than the few lines quoted during the research, and have to assume that the opening of the Hellmouth was done for the benefit of the Vahrals themselves, for the three to give themselves as willing sacrifices.

Giles was turned into a Fyarl Demon by one of our favorite agents of chaos, Ethan Rayne. While Giles had the outer aspect of the demon, he was initially 100% Giles on the inside. He goes to Xander for assistance first, but Xander is unable to understand him. As Giles wanders around trying to decide what to do, he runs into Spike, who happens to speak Fyarl and is able to understand him. Spike agrees to help him for an appropriate sum of money, and is also able to give Giles information about the type of demon he is. A sort of demon soldier, very strong and has a paralyzing mucous. He also finds that the demon instincts are very simple - crush, kill. Giles is able to override these instincts, but does give in to one Ripper moment when he gets out of the car solely to frighten and chase Professor Walsh, which he does quite satisfactorily. Giles is very nearly fully in Fyarl mode when he confronts Ethan and tries to kill him. He might even have been successful if Buffy hadn't intervened. Buffy fights with Giles and is ready to kill the demon when she realizes that it's Giles from the look in his eyes. We don't see how Giles is restored, but the implication is that Ethan is forced to reverse the spell.

The Polgara Demon is sought by the Initiative and they are briefed on it's appearance and their orders: it has bone skewers that protrude from its forearms in battle and they are not to damage it's arms. Because the Initiative does not believe it has ant relevance, all of the usual questions that the Scoobies research about motive and style are ignored. It is successfully captured, intact, and we learn that there is an experiment in which the forearm is being grafted onto Adam, their creation. While the demon itself was not difficult for them to subdue, nor was it significant except for the harvest of it's arm, the incident did serve to make Maggie Walsh even more suspicious of Buffy and the questions she insisted on continuing to ask.

MONSTERS

The Gentlemen
and their ghouls were two parts of one of the creepiest groups of villains the Scoobies have faced. The Gentlemen are monsters from a fairy tale who first steal everyone's voices and then cut out the hearts from seven of them. They seem to be selective in the hearts they choose, passing several by before settling on one. The Gentlemen work in pairs, encouraging and congratulating one another with their ghoulish unchanging smiles. Part of their eeriness is due to that unchanging set smile in their cadaverous faces and the seeming implacability of their purpose. They waste no motion, floating smoothly to their destinations. In contrast, their lackeys are misshapen and straitjacketed, lurching along, with apparently no independent thought and great strength. They are presented as a mute parody of the cretinous minion from clas sic horror. It is their duty to secure the victims and hold them while the Gentlemen cut the beating heart out of the conscious victim. Only the sound of a human scream can defeat them - they are unable to handle noise, and the sound of a human scream will destroy them. [Although one does wonder what affect Slim Whitman amplified would have on them]. Buffy is able, with Riley's help, to regain her voice and destroy the menace of the Gentlemen and their goons. During the time while everyone was mute, they were forced to find alternate methods for communication, and it was interesting to observe that all of the extended Scoobies were able to cope by signs and body language with one notable exception. As Xander said in Fear Itself, "That's the funny thing about me, I tend to hear the actual words people say and accept them at face value." We see just how literally he meant that - Xander is almost incapable of interpreting body language and expressions, and quite often even obvious actions. Willow and Buffy quickly realize that both of them are affected, Spike realizes it almost immediately, but Xander doesn't get it until after the phone call from Buffy, when he realizes no one is talking. He is the one who misinterprets everything during Giles' presentation. He attacks Spike based on a single image without looking at the whole situation. (Of course, this makes Anya happy, and she makes a suggestion using the one gesture Xander understands on the first try). It was also interesting to note how people were shown to respond to the phenomenon, some coping, some taking advantage, some crying in distress, others becoming quite belligerent. The two groups that were shown attempting to either defuse or resolve the situation were the Scoobies and the Initiative. One other rather interesting aspect of the muteness was the degree to which everyone seemed to act as though deafness was also a part of it. Why didn't the Initiative operatives have a code they could tap, even something simple, like an idea code and a quadrant code so they could summon the others to help? Relationships seemed to develop clarity during this time as well: Riley and Buffy finally show they do care; Anya learns Xander cares enough to beat up Spike because he thought Spike had hurt her; Willow and Tara meet and join their abilities to keep each other safe. Even Giles and Olivia's relationship moves to another level as Olivia learns that these are the sorts of things Giles deals with routinely. There was only one question that seemed to remain at the end - what would have happened if the Gentlemen had been successful in getting the seven hearts? What was their goal?

Jonathon's gift-with-purchase was created when Jonathan cast the spell to alter the BuffyVerse and become the best of the best as the balancing force, or the worst of the worst. The monster was inextricably tied to the augmentation spell so that destroying it would break the spell. Once Buffy began suspecting that things were not as they seemed, it rapidly led to the demise of the monster, and thus of the spell.

The zombies created by Adam from the Initiative personnel he killed were used by him to assist in the creation of more demon/cyborgs like himself. The two we were shown working for him were Maggie Walsh and Dr. Angleman, the two who knew the most about how the experiments were conducted, and therefore the ones most qualified to assist in the creation of new ones. It is ironic that the demon-cyborg they had built and intended to use as a tool had now reanimated them and was using them as his tools. They were successful with Adam beyond their wildest dreams, and their very inability to dream that wildly now confined their mindless bodies to the performance of basic maintenance functions on the other demon-cyborgs that Adam was creating and improving upon.

POSSESSION

Lowell House
is the house the Initiative uses for its operatives, and the underground operations center. It seems that the increased sexual activity of Riley and Buffy awakened the suppressed spiritual energy of the children and adolescents who had lived there when it was a children's home. At first the manifestation is of thermal, beginning with a draining of the heat in the house and finally bursting into bonfire level flames from the fireplace, injuring one of the Initiative commandos. They are able to affect Buffy and Riley to the point where their whole concentration continually turns to sex, and eventually forcing them into a continual cycle that will end only when they are completed drained of energy. Then they die. As they consume the energy that that Riley and Buffy generate, more and more of those in the house are effected. The very walls are suffused by the sexual energy. Various persons are individually affected, acting out the horrid retributions that were inflicted on the children for nothing more than having normal thoughts and wanting to find out more about the changes they were going through. It is Xander, and also notably Anya, who save them. They return to the house while Giles, Willow and Tara distract the apparitions by attempting to convinced them to stop. The children didn't take kindly to the suggestion that they just get over it. The house attempts to drown Xander, who is saved by a very determined Anya, and together they manage to get to, and open, the door to Riley's room, which breaks the hold the childish spirits had on Buffy and Riley. At first it seems strange that this particular phenomenon had never manifested before, but when considering the two major players, perhaps it isn't so odd after all. Buffy and Riley present a very unique couple from this standpoint, not that they had a greater desire for one another than other couples had, but that both of them had stamina far beyond the norm. Riley is the prime human experiment of the Initiative and its enhancements program, and as for Buffy, as Parker so indelicately put it, "the word is stamina." So they may have been the first that could generate the energy necessary to awaken the repressed spirits.

ALTERED REALITY

The JonathanVerse
was as impressive an alternate reality as the WishVerse had been, the difference being that the Jverse was an altered reality. It was a spell placed on the BuffyVerse reality. One of the more intriguing aspects of the Jverse is that Jonathan chose to be a hero, to be acclaimed for his positive contributions to life and happiness. Of course, nothing is ever that simple, and the Jverse was no different. The positive was countered by the negative, a monster who embodied all the negative aspects, the worst nightmares. The destruction of the monster, who was menacing people also meant the destruction of the spell and of the Jverse altered reality. Another difference of the altered reality from an alternate reality is that the inhabitants of the Jverse remained aware of what had been done, at least for a while.

SPIRIT AVENGERS

Hus
is a Chumash Spirit-Warrior, manifested after the old mission was opened during the ground-breaking ceremony for a new cultural center. He materialized from a Chumash knife, and killed the professor who was in charge of the cultural center. Because it was Xander who fell through and opened the mission, he was cursed with syhphilis, a disease unknown to Native Americans until the Europeans brought it to them. He then goes after Father Gabriel at the church, whose family dates back to mission times, and Buffy finds him as he is cutting Father Gabriel's throat after hanging him. Hus is recreating the wrongs visited upon his people by the settlers who massacred his people. To aid him Hus summons the First People of Mishuipashup (ancestral spirits) and the Nunashush creatures of the night. They manifest as Chumash warriors as well. They seek out the strongest warrior, Buffy, and begin their attack. Through the combination of the Slayer, the Scoobies and Angel, Hus and his raiding party are vanquished. A unique aspect of this opponent is that he is not a demon, but a vengeful spirit, created by those who wronged his people and, ironically, released during the excavation of a cultural partnership center, to celebrate the contributions made by all cultures, including those who are no longer active parts of American culture because they were obliterated in the creating of America as a country. There is, however, one burning question that this episode raises that has nothing really to do with Hus or the Chumash: Who is Aunt Darlene?

CURSES

The Cave-men
were the result of a curse placed on a favorite brand of draft beer at one of the campus area bar. The students who were targeted by this temporary curse were the ones who were viewed by the bar owner as coming in with their snotty attitudes and deserving to become the Neanderthals they seemed to think others were. Unfortunately, the beer was also shared by Buffy, which put a Neanderthal Slayer on the streets. When the cave-men went out, they generally looked to fulfill basic needs ... food and women. As it happend, though, they did not have any clue about even basic precautions and eventually caused a fire to break out where Willow was. Luckily, even though she was a cave-girl, Buffy's Slayer instincts remained strong as did her friend instincts and she was able to prevent people from dying. One of the interesting aspects of the caved-men was that for all the college level intellectual conversation, at the base they were the same as all others - seeking food, shelter and a way to reproduce. It was their intellect that set them apart and their attitude about their intellect that made them a target.

to be continued...

[liberal use of Psyche's transcripts for details]

[> Evolution of Evil in the BuffyVerse from Simple Evil to Pogo, Part Four (2 of 2) -- LittleBit, 21:35:52 01/12/03 Sun

Evolution of Evil in the BuffyVerse from Simple Evil to Pogo, Part Four --- continued

HUMANS

Parker Abrams
is a guy who trades on his good looks and charm to convince whatever woman attracts him at the moment to sleep with him. He brings this considerable arsenal to bear on Buffy, who is taken in by it and succumbs, even initiates the romantic encounter, only to find come morning that Parker had no interest beyond the chase and catch. Parker is also known among the guys for both his 'prowess' and his bragging, as well as his willingness to share the details. Willow described him quite accurately and succinctly: "poophead."

Jack the pub owner felt justified in exacting a petty revenge against random college students because for years he felt condescended to with their intellectual attitudes. He has a brother-in-law who's a warlock and gave him the spell to use. Unfortunately, there is no way to control who is served the tainted beer, and so Buffy gets a share of it as well, when she is in a mood that allows her to get drunk. Jack is one the most irresponsible little bads the Scoobies have faced up to now. He seemed to believe that his responsibility regarding the spell ended with the knowledge that it would "wear off in a few days." In that time immeasurable damage could have been caused, and was to the lounge area; it was only due to the fact that the Slayer instincts seemed to still be functioning that there weren't several deaths that first night. If Buffy hadn't been able to figure a way out, the cavemen boys, the girls they abducted, Parker and Willow would all have perished in the fire. And Jack would never have seen the connection. His pettiness, short-sightedness and, well, lack of common sense actually make the college boys who condescended to him as being too stupid to do anything more demanding than serve beer to them right about him.

Veruca is first seen when she and Oz pass one another and each seems to sense the presence of the other, turning to glance at one another. They meet and connect, seemingly over music as a shared passion. Veruca is mildly mocking of Willow but not obviously so. We then see Veruca is in werewolf shape. She and Oz attack one another, the implication when they wake the following morning that more than just an attack happened. Veruca is quite comfortable with the situation, but Oz is clearly disturbed by it. Veruca tells him he should let that part of his nature run free. Her demeanor is very seductive, quite predatory and very on-the-prowl-ish. Oz, however, is very uncomfortable when he sees Willow later, who comes by hinting about getting cozy; he finds he can't be close right now. Veruca finds Oz as he's locking himself into his cage, and tries to convince him to come out with her, let the animal out, enjoy it. Oz refuses and pulls Veruca into the cage with him. Willow finds them entwined, naked, in the morning when she comes by to find Oz. Oz attempts an explanation, but Veruca's suggestive manner only makes things worse. Veruca then seeks out Willow and finds her alone, and threatens her, but before she can do anything, Oz gets there and challenges her. Veruca and Oz both wolf out and attack each other, ending with Oz tearing her throat out. Oz then starts after Willow but is stopped by Buffy. Veruca shows us clearly what the full acceptance of the wolf inside means, and lets us understand more of the conflict that Oz feels with a part of his nature that manifests only three nights a month, and his determination that he never give those impulses free rein. In the end, it is Veruca's assertion and his own attempted attack on Willow that convinces Oz that in some ways Veruca is right, that the wolf is always there. She is the catalyst for Oz's decision to leave until he can fins a way to be certain that he controls the wolf and the wolf does not control him the way it controlled her.

Willow uses her power as a witch for the first time in a completely selfish manner, giving us a glimpse into just how far she considers going in the name of vengeance when she's feeling hurt, and also how recklessly she is willing to use magic. She begins and very nearly completes a spell to curse Oz and Veruca, to break their hearts, to assure that they will have no love, no solace, no peace, only hate. She waivers at the last moment and stops the spell. Which may be more to the good than she knew ... with the wording of the spell, their hearts may well have been 'broken' in a much more literal manner than she had intended. After Oz leaves town, Willow wants to make her heartache stop hurting so she performs the 'my will be done' spell but is disappointed when her first requests are not granted. The actual results of the spell range from the amusing and absurd to downright dangerous and life-threatening; all of them things Willow 'wills' inadvertently. Giles comes by the next morning to find out what happened to her, and when she gets upset that he is not being as sympathetic to her situation as she thinks he should be, she causes him to go blind merely by saying he doesn't se anything. When she is telling Buffy her frustration with her magic ability an offhand reference changes Amy into human form, and an equally offhand comment turns her immediately back. Later, after Buffy has had to leave to find Spike, Willow is expressing her anger that Buffy left, and says sarcastically that Buffy will probably find him just standing there, and to the great surprise of both Buffy and Spike, she does. When Xander tries to defend Buffy's duties and priorities, Willow takes it personally, and in saying Spike is more important than she is, also says Buffy should just marry him ... resulting in a sudden proposal and acceptance. When Xander tries to tell her things will get better she turns on him, listing a few of his relationships and labeling him a demon-magnet. Willow has no idea any of this is occurring. But that final willing very nearly costs her all of her friends, for Xander does indeed become a demon magnet, and no matter how many they kill or take out, more and more just keep coming. When they look for Willow she has been abducted by d'Hoffryn, who offers her a position as a vengeance demon. Anya realizes what has happened and attempts to call d'Hoffryn but is rattled by the fact that while she is making the attempt, they are all beset by more and more demons. It is d'Hoffryn who opens Willow's eyes to the chaos she has created for her friends, and she immediately wants to make it stop. d'Hoffryn allows her to leave and she appears in the crypt where they are and cancels the spell. While Willow learned that she had great power and that her spell had not gone awry, neither she nor any of the others seem to realize that the spell only worked when there was strong emotion behind the command. And, at least in this spell, emotions generally classified in the 'negative' category: frustration, anger, irritation, annoyance. It also seems that no one noticed that the spells she did cast on them were not of a trivial nature ... if it had been intentional, there would have been a great deal of malice behind it. As it was, there was just petulance, and no real intent to harm, which in a way should have thrown up more red flags than if there had been intent. If she could do this much damage unintentionally, what could she do if she wanted to. This is one reason why she was very fortunate she aborted the spell against Oz and Veruca - she would have been devastated if she had caused them to die when their hearts broke. Willow showed herself as being capable of self-absorption to the extent of wanting everyone else around her to wallow with her in her self-pity. She also showed the level of magic she was capable of producing when emotion was driving her, as well as the extent to which she might go for revenge. One does wonder though - what would have happened if Joyce had died while this spell was in effect and Willow's reaction had been to say, "No! She can't be dead!"?

Jonathan has been on the edges of the gang for years now. He has been a source of amusement and of pity. Jonathan was allowed once to wait on Cordelia at the Bronze, after she was kidnapped by the frat guys, and was the butt of the joke by Harmony after Cordelia and Xander spilt up. He was at Buffy's 'welcome back' [from rehab?] party. He was in her law enforcement group during career week - which was rather surprising actually. Jonathan came front and center when he attempted to kill himself and was mistaken for the person who was going to murder the students. Although, how he was planning to commit suicide with a rifle is somewhat less clear. Then again, Jonathan was never the planner. Jonathan is selected to present Buffy with the Class Protector Award at the prom, which he does with great pride, and which he attends with a very attractive date. But all of the moments Jonathan has shared with the Scoobies have been merely peripheral, with no true connections happening. When we see him this season, Buffy had already exhibited a reluctance to take on a mere five vamps with Willow, Xander and Anya to help and they go for help, and lo and behold the help is Jonathan. Which comes as a surprise. Jonathan is clearly perceived by Buffy and all the Scoobies as well as Giles [Rupert] to be the go-to guy when things get rough. He handily defeats Giles at chess, he exterminates the next of vampires with ease ... and is met by a gaggle of photographers afterward. Jonathan offers advice to both Buffy and Riley regarding their relationship problems. He's approached regularly with autograph seekers. The Initiative commander, Colonel George, brings in a tactical consultant to help them work out the plan for finding and stopping Adam. Jonathan. Who also, by studying Adam's design schematics informs them that Adam's power is a small reservoir of U-235, which now means that Adam will 'live' forever unless the power source is destroyed. Jonathan is a surprise singer at the Bronze, mesmerizing the crowd with a ballad (which also gets Buffy and Riley back in each other's arms when they dance), then electrifying them by beginning to sing his newest song for them. He is interrupted by one of his groupies who was hanging around outside his mansion hoping for a glimpse of him when she was attacked by a monster with a mark on its head. Jonathan is noticeably shaken by this for a moment, and then brushes it off, telling Buffy not to worry about it. However, Jonathan does worry about it. As Buffy gets closer and closer to the truth, Jonathan does admit that the monster and he are connected, and that is why he had the mark tattooed on his back. When Buffy suggests going after it with him, he reluctantly agrees. While they are searching, the Scoobies do research and learn that the mark is an augmentation spell, and that the monster is a result of the spell, the opposite force of evil, and that if the monster is destroyed, the spell will be cancelled. To Jonathan's credit, while he doesn't help Buffy in confronting the monster, he also doesn't hinder her. And when it looks like the monster is going to kill Buffy, Jonathan intervenes and pushes it into the bottomless pit, nearly going with it; only Buffy grabbing his ankle saves him. The whole of Sunnydale is then seen reverting back to reality; a reality in which Jonathan is just an insignificant person who is always on the sidelines. And once again, this is where they leave him. Jonathan showed that he wants very much to have recognition and accolades - but is this what he truly wanted? Or did he want to belong somewhere ... somewhere he could contribute and make a difference. Jonathan, through his spell, gained the acceptance of the 'world' but more specifically of the Scooby Gang, and acceptance he wanted very badly. By being an integral and important part of the group, he was able to contribute to their efforts, rather than be shut out of them. Given the power that he had to be able to use to successfully perform a spell of that magnitude, it is telling that he chose to use a spell that would make him a hero.

Genevieve Holt was a woman who did great evil and harm in the name of righteousness. She was very proud of what she had done, and the medal she was given saying how good she was with the children. The disadvantaged children: runaways, juvenile delinquents and the emotionally disturbed. She punished them for vanity, for having 'impure' thoughts or deeds. She truly believed she was 'saving' them from sin, helping them to gain admittance to the kingdom, cleansing them of their lust. What she achieved instead was physical and emotional abuse of adolescents who were already identified as a risk group; and the residual of a malevolent spirit that fed on sexual energy and very nearly killed Riley and Buffy in their need to feed. In some ways, Mrs. Holt is the worst kind of human villain, one who firmly believes that her actions are necessary in order to save the souls of others, who believes that the crimes of vanity and lust (normal adolescent feelings) require extreme measures to assure that they will not be repeated. And who is proud of herself for doing it. She was also a difficult villain for the Scoobies because, other than stopping the current manifestation of the adolescent poltergeist, there is nothing they could do about the damage Mrs. Holt had inflicted on those children all those years ago ... the adults they would have grown into would be in their mid-50's to mid-60's, and well past any real intervention. The one consolation was that Mrs. Holt was no longer in a postion to inflict her views on defenseless children.

Maggie Walsh. An acclaimed psychologist with a specialty in operant conditioning. Also 'The Evil Bitch Monster of Death.' Professor Walsh had two significant functions. First she was an influential instructor who was very tough but fair in that rules were adhered to and not administered on an individual basis. As a psychology professor, she was quite good, encouraging without favoritism. One small surprise is that a professor of her stature in the psychology community was teaching introductory psych, but perhaps that was more a reflection of the size of the UC/Sunnydale faculty that anything else, but it would have been more likely that she would be teaching at the upperclassman and graduate levels. Second and more significant though, Maggie Walsh was in charge of the Initiative, a [seeming] government and military sponsored group that researched demons, vampires and other monsters. In some ways, it seems as though the Initiative may have been partly her brain-child - she seems to be the guiding force behind much of the experimentation and technology that is used by the group. Because the Initiative is composed of both scientific and military personnel, there are widely varying degrees of autonomy within the group - and Maggie Walsh has the greatest amount. She is very determined that nothing undermine the group's goals, and that ultimately puts her at odds with Buffy and the Scoobies in ways she doesn't even realize. When Riley brings Buffy into the group, she welcomes her outwardly, but seems to harbor inner doubts about having her on the team. When she interviews Buffy she is politely condescending about the methods of the Slayer when contrasted to the technology of the Initiative, and is likely not pleased to learn of the efficacy of a 'pointed stick' when wielded by Buffy. Maggie has also been involved in experimentation far beyond that of trying to learn how demons function, and thus how to neutralize them, and possibly use them. She has been experimenting on the special operatives themselves, without their knowledge, to enhance their performance in the field. She has also been working with Dr. Angelman to construct a demon-human-techno hybrid, or a demon-cyborg. Maggie uses others in her research with little regard for their individuality, not making much of a distinction between using the 'animals' and using the humans. Unfortunately for her, the first and foremost of those humans, Adam, has been a much more successful project than she ever imagined - he is sentient, has all of the technology at his fingertips (and can understand it), and he knows his purpose: to kill. And he does. Starting with Maggie herself - "Mommy."

Forrest Gates is one of the Initiative operatives who poses as a student at the college and one of Riley's best friends. He and Riley went through training together, and Forrest is Riley's second-in-command. Forrest is the one who first notices Buffy, while Riley seems oblivious to her. It is Forrest who questions Parker about Buffy, which forces Riley to the realization that he likes her. It is also Forrest who cautions Riley about Buffy, that he can't share with her who and what he is. When Riley begins to take a greater interest in Buffy, Forrest reacts almost with jealousy. He doesn't want to hear Riley talk about her, tries to change the subject when Riley brings her up. When Riley brings Buffy into the initiative, Forrest is not very welcoming. He resents Buffy's abilities and is actually angry when she is tested and bests them all easily. Forrest is disgruntled when Riley makes Buffy his second on patrol, even though he assigned Forrest as a team leader - a step up. His conversations with her are generally brief, and somewhat acidic. When Professor Walsh is killed, Forrest immediately assumes it was Buffy who did it, not changing that opinion even when a demon with a bio-weapon that is a skewer is known to have escaped. He is resentful of the time Riley and Buffy spend together, nearly contemptuous of the fact that they are sleeping together. His dislike of her is nearly irrational, with very little fact and a great deal of emotion driving it. Ultimately, they face one another while they are independently searching for Adam, which gives Adam an advantage, and he kills Forrest. Or so we think, until Adam captures Riley and we learn that he has done the same thing to Forrest that Professor Walsh and Dr. Angleman did to him - turned him into a demon-cyborg. Forrest is now helping Adam to do this to Riley. When Buffy arrives to rescue Riley, Adam orders Forrest to kill her, an order he gladly follows. He successfully delays Buffy, and they seem evenly matched, but Riley manages to free himself and takes over for her. This fight, between Forrest and Riley, has been a long time coming. Finally, Forrest will learn, in a fight in which no holds are barred, which of them is the superior - and Forrest knows he's been enhanced by Adam. But Forrest hasn't the creative edge, he tends to go straight in, while Riley uses everything he has available around him, which in combination proves fatal for Forrest. Forrest is mostly peripheral to the Buffy and Riley relationship, but he provides a constant disapproving force that casts a shadow over him. From the start he did not see Buffy as an individual, a person in her own right. When he first noticed her it was in terms of her being mattressable. He did not like knowing that she was more capable than a team of Initiative special operatives. When Buffy took Riley's time and attention away, and also showed herself to be a partner in every sense of the word, Forrest was not able to cope with that change, or to adjust his perception of the opposite sex to allow for it.

Dr. Angleman is the lead physician on the Initiative team. He is the one who works most closely with Maggie Walsh. It is Dr. Angleman who is responsible for the patchwork that is Adam. Dr. Angleman in some ways is one of the more frightening members of the Initiative. At some point in his life, when he became a physician, Dr. Angleman took an oath to above all do no harm. And yet he finds it possible to experiment on the men in the special ops division, and to create the demon-cyborg that is Adam. To his credit, he did not agree with Maggie that Buffy needed to be killed. To his discredit, he did nothing to stop her. Had he actively opposed her, he may have jeopardized his position, and this he would not do under any circumstances. However, this dedication doesn't help him once Adam determines he is no longer necessary. Dr. Angleman finds out firsthand how well the nice Polgara arm with skewer works.

Colonel McNamara takes over temporary command of the Initiative after Professor Walsh and Dr. Angleman are killed. He is very by-the-book military in his outlook. No one and nothing has much of an individual identity for him. The demons and monsters they capture and experiment on are animals. Riley is "the boy." Buffy is "the girl," and "just a girl" at that. He is dismissive of the potential havoc that the overcrowding could cause, quite satisfied for the demons to fight with and kill each other, complacently certain that the containment system cannot go down. Buffy and her friends are considered "freaks" by him, anarchists, too backward for the for the real world. Perhaps he's right. But what the colonel hasn't yet realized is that Sunnydale is not much like that 'real world' he's referring to. He's incapable of thinking outside the box, of comprehending that the well-regulated world in which he lives is perhaps not so well-regulated after all. Unfortunately, this inability, this narrow outlook costs him very nearly all the lives of the Initiative. As a villain, he is possibly the most human we've seen before - it is only his desire to keep his ordered world intact that blinds him to the fact that it is crumbling around him.

Faith is back again, rising from her coma against all expectations. She harbors great resentment for Buffy, for everyone really. Her first act is one of violence - beating and stripping a hospital visitor for her clothing. After stopping for a look at the destroyed high school, she goes over to Giles' and eavesdrops outside his window. The next day she then goes to the college campus and waits for Buffy, who comes walking by with Willow. What is intriguing about the exchange is that the first accusation Faith makes is not about Buffy trying to kill her, but that for eight months Buffy never came to visit her. Faith sums up Buffy's motivation and current status quite succinctly, but missing a few salient details. What she really wants is the chance to retaliate. They fight, ending it only when a police car shows up, and Faith skedaddles pronto. Faith is found by a demon, who has a remembrance for her from the Mayor. Faith thanks him for his troubles by unceremoniously snapping his neck and then watches the videotape he had for her. He gives her a gift that will allow her the revenge they both seek. She goes to Buffy's house and invites herself in with a fist to Joyce's eye. Faith also hits home in another way, pointing out that she's sure Buffy hasn't spent much time with her mom since she left for college. When Buffy arrives, they once again fight, but something different happens this time - during the fight Faith slips the device she received from the Mayor, and grabs Buffy's hand with it tightly clasped between their palms. It glows from between their hands, and both react strongly to it. Then Buffy knocks Faith out. Joyce has called the police and now looks to see if Buffy is okay. Buffy assures he that she's "five by five." Faith is then taken into custody by the police. When Buffy and Joyce talk afterward, Joyce is a little surprised by Buffy's callousness about Faith, but we the audience are not. We now know she's Faith. She makes herself at home, then finds Buffy's passport, and Joyce's wallet. She uses Joyce's credit card to book a flight, and steals the money from the wallet. Faith/buffy then goes to Giles' for a meeting of the Scoobies, and learns that Buffy/faith is now in the Council's hands. Faith/buffy says she'll patrol, but instead goes to the Bronze and is having a great time. She evens encounters Spike,, with whom she has a very sexually suggestive conversation, although Spike never knows she's not really Buffy. Willow and Tara run into her there, and Tara, who is insulted by her realizes that she is not Buffy. Meanwhile, Willow spots a vampire hitting on a girl and heading outside, and Faith/buffy realizes that she'd better do her job. When she does, though, she's taken aback and confused by the girl's very sincere thank you. After a casual question from Willow, Faith/buffy decides to pay a surprise visit to Riley, one that turns out far differently than she ever expected. Riley is the type of guy she always insisted didn't exist, who truly cared, and acted that way. Faith/buffy is completely thrown when Riley tells her he loves her after they've made love. Afterward, when she is leaving, she runs into Forrest who is his usual charming self and begins to defend Buffy to him, then realizes what she is doing and stops. She heads to the airport, and while waiting for her flight hears on the news about three "frighteningly disfigured" men who were holding a church congregation hostage. What she doesn't know is that Willow and Tara have devised another katra to reverse the switching spell, and Giles now knows that Buffy has Faith's appearance. Faith heads to the church and confronts the three vampires, now getting more and more into Buffy's persona. When she tells them they are not going to kill the hostages "because it's wrong" she now means it. And 'gets it.' The real Buffy arrives and dusts the final vampire. Faith/buffy attacks her counterpart, and beats her mercilessly, saying to her all the things that have been said about Faith - and showing that Buffy was more right than even she knew when she told her (after Faith had killed the deputy-mayor) that she could "shut off all the emotions you want ... but eventually they're gonna find a body." And they had. Faith was able to pour all of her inner hatred and contempt out upon her own body while she was possessing Buffy's. Buffy manages to get the katra into place and they shift back to their own bodies. Both are in shock and disoriented, possibly from the switch, possibly from the emotion that had just been released. Faith runs out, and disappears. During this time Faith went from a single-minded desire to destroy Buffy to an understanding of why Buffy feels the way she does, and understanding of just what "because it's wrong" really means. And when she understands that, she finds herself in tremendous inner turmoil, finally realizing what she had allowed herself to become. She took the first small steps on a long road when she did what Buffy would have done, solely because "it was right."

The Watchers' Council has had one of their field operatives on duty at the hospital to keep an eye on their comatose rogue Slayer, so they are notified that Faith is gone almost as quickly as the police are. The special operations retrieval team, with great presumption, make themselves comfortable at Giles' home after arriving by helicopter. When Buffy/faith is being transported but the police the Council's retrieval team takes her into custody by force. Once she is awake, Weatherby makes it clear that he holds her in the deepest contempt, referring to her as "it" and spitting in her face because he couldn't kill her at that point. Collins is much more business-like, simply viewing her as a job to do. While they are waiting for their next instructions, the third man, Smith, decides to interrupt Buffy/faith's incessant banging against the inside of the armored van. When he does, she captures him and attempts to use him as a hostage, but Weatherby and Collins both tell her to go ahead and kill him. She can't do this, of course, so she lets him go to his vast surprise. Once they have the word to kill her, Collins goes to shoot her, but she manages to get his gun from him and knock him unconscious, through the bars with her feet no less, then use the gun to free herself. She then gets into the front of the van, knocks Weatherby unconscious by slamming the door into his face, and escapes. After this spectacular failure, the team is called off. Once again showing that the Watchers' Council's main shortcoming is not unlike that of the Initiative - a failure of imagination. It never once occurred to them that a Slayer could escape from their best special ops team, even though the Slayer is still living after facing much less favorable odds than that, and against those who actively sought her death from the moment she encountered them.

The First Slayer visited each of the Scoobies in dreamscapes, attempting at the end of each dream to kill the Scooby whose dream it was. Willow is left choking, Xander is left with gasping and writhing after his heart is wrenched out, Giles' head is attacked. Buffy is physically attacked, a fight that spills over into the Summers' living room when the dreaming Buffy wakes up - a fight that is ended when she refuses to fight any longer. The First Slayer is not used to being ignored. According to Giles, the dream manifestations were brought on as a response to invoking the power of the First to enjoin them as spiritus, animus and sophus to combine with Buffy as manus to defeat Adam. As a little bad, the First Slayer is quite enigmatic ... and wouldn't be an evil at all were it not for the attempts to kill each of them. In the process of the dreams much is revealed in an obscure manner, and much about the inner psyches of the Scoobies [none of which will be dealt with here]. At the same time, questions are raised, in particular about the actual nature of the Slayer. The First does not speak, borrowing Tara to be her voice, and is most primitive, primal. She admonishes Buffy for having her friends, instructs her. "I live in the action of death, the blood cry, the penetrating wound ... I am destruction. Absolute ... alone." Buffy denies that. She is not alone. "The slayer does not walk in this world." Again, Buffy's denial and demand that her friends be returned. "No ... friends! Just the kill. ... We ... are ... alone!" But Buffy is not alone, has never been alone except when she faced Angelus for the last time. She has always prevailed, at times when other Slayers would have failed, in part due to her changing the rules, the her not being alone, relying on friends for moral support, for research, and physical assistance. What is not known is whether the First Slayer would have killed them all, or if the attempt itself was the message; nor do we know why the First Slayer came with such a message. Is there something more to the message than we yet know?




This season the Scoobies faced a Big Bad that was organized at a level they had never faced before. The Initiative was a combined military and scientific experiment to determine whether or not the HSTs could be harnessed to work for the humans, for the government. In this season not only the Big Bad but a far greater percentage of the little bads they encountered were either human themselves, or cuased by human action. The Initiative is a sretictly human endeavor, ultimately creating the hybrid monster that was Adam. Hus and the warriors he called to aid him exist to avenge the wrongs done by the encroaching settlers to the Chumash tribe. Lowell House is haunted because of the evil done to the children who lived there in the name of saving their souls by Mrs. Holt. The JonathanVerse altered reality ans the monster generated by the spll that created that new reality were Jonathan's fault. The cave-men were degenerated by the bar owner, Jack, to spite the intellectual college students that he felt condescended to him. The zombies, Maggie Walsh, Dr. Angleman and the others were created by the Initiative's failed grand experiment, Adam. Even some of the demons that they face this season are there because of human foibles: Gachnar is inadvertently called through a series of unconnected events that, in sequence, completed the ritual to call the Fear Demon. A demon who has great power only so long as those affected grant power to their fears. d'Hoffryn appears in response to the chaos and pain caused by Willow's spell to have her will done, a spell she was certain was a failure. There is a growing list of human little bads, including a few returning evils, most notably Faith and the Watchers' Council. There are still vampires - Sunday, Spike, Harmony and Adam's recruits: Boone and his two minions - Sunnydale just wouldn't be the same without vampires. And a smattering of other demons, most notably Buffy's first roommate, Kathy, and the Vahral Demons who very nearly succeed in re-opening the Hellmouth.

And of course, one of the most chilling villains the Scoobies have faced: The Gentlemen and their goons. Monsters from the old fairy tales, who silence all and gather the hearts of seven. The silence is as much their nemesis as the Gentlemen themselves are. Communication and human interaction is an underlying aspect to this season. As they began this season the Scoobies found that they had moved apart ... Giles as an unemployed librarian/watcher tells Buffy that she has to take care of things herself; Xander, the 'townie' who isn't part of the college life, is not even present at the very beginning; Willow is so excited about starting college and being near Oz that she is blind to everything else, and Buffy is on her own as the Slayer. While they come together loosely to battle the evils they face, they lack the cohesion that marked the previous three years. When Buffy insists that her roommate is a demon, no one is willing to believe her - they go so far as to tie her up to prevent her from confronting the roommate. Giles does at least check on Buffy's facts and determines that she is quite correct. As relationship start, falter, blossom and crumble, they support one another, but are also withdrawing from each other. At almost the central point of the season, the communication breakdown becomes complete - no one can even speak to one another, or to anyone else for that matter. They continue their drifting apart, Buffy becoming more involved with Riley and the Initiative, Willow with magic and Tara, Xander with Anya. Their estrangement reaches the point where once Faith has switched bodies with Buffy, none of the Scoobies, or even Buffy's mother or boyfriend, realize the change. It took an outsider, Tara, to see it immediately, although Tara saw it as a disruption of the energy flow about her. The introduction into their lives of an evil Spike who can't harm anyone both divides and unites them. After they learn that Spike has deliberately and far too easily divided them, playing on their insecurities and resentments, they are both chagrined and determined to put it behind them. After this they become closer and in greater communication than they have ever been before - they must merge themselves to give Buffy the power she needs to defeat Adam. Even the dreams they have as a result of the spell they used and the use of the power of the Slayer line have commonalities, and each has integral parts in the other's dreams. The group that began only loosely associated and disintegrated to the point where none of them were communicating, ended as tightly cohesive as they had ever been.

Your feedback is welcomed!

[liberal use of Psyche's transcripts for details]

[> [> Fantastic post (but a heretical view on Oz) -- KdS, 03:10:52 01/13/03 Mon

Don't have a great deal to add except that I have a slightly more ambiguous attitude to the Oz/Veruca issue than you do. As I see it, we can't assume that any werewolf who integrated their animal and human sides would be as amoral and murderous as Veruca was - it's possible that Veruca was that way before she became a werewolf. Oz assumes that Veruca's typical, but that might just have been down to self-hatred.

When Oz gets back to SD in New Moon Rising he's dealt with his wolf side by utterly repressing it, but at the cost of it breaking out uncontrollably when he experiences strong emotions. Despite his romantic belief that it's Willow alone who has the power to bring it out, he still wolfs out when he's tortured by the Initiative (and he wolfs out with both Tara and the Initiative in the daytime). The impression I get is that he's far more dangerous in this state than he was when he was locking himself in a cage every night to get catharsis - without the catharsis he's a bomb who can go off at any time. I'd hate to think what would happen if someone tried to mug him or he got into a bar fight.

It may conflict with ME's tendency to see dreams of supernatural transcendence as an adolescent trap, but if Oz had ever come back, I'd like to have seen him discover that he could fully integrate his personality and retain his intelligence and moral sense in werewolf form. (Not that I'm hoping for some fluffy New Age werewolf - I'm thinking something more akin to the essentially decent but calmly lethal protagonist of Neil Gaiman's story The Hunt).

[> [> [> Re: Thoughtful summations, observations and clarifications -- Brian, 06:13:27 01/13/03 Mon


[> [> [> Re: Not so heretical -- LittleBit, 12:02:29 01/13/03 Mon

We do have only two werewolves to use as a comparison. And I agree, Veruca's predatory attitude may well have been part of her personality long before she became a werewolf. On the other hand, she may have been bitten as young as Oz's cousin Jordy, and the wolfishness may have played a significant part in the formation of her mature personality. We simply don't know. What we do know about her is that she has embraced the wolf inside, and pities those who don't have this as lesser creatures, and that Oz does not buy into this.

I also agree that Oz is more dangerous right now when he can change at any time simply by having his emotions loosen his control, or by application of pain that overrides his conscious control. Before, he needed to be contained from sunset to sunrise on three well-defined nights each moon cycle. He believed he had control until it was severely tested, and then realized he hadn't gone far enough. And you are right --- at least as far as we are aware, he had not recognized that Willow was not the only thing that could erode his control. I, too, would love to see him come back, fully in control of the wolf, with intellect and morality intact. But I think, within the boundaries of the BuffyVerse that the best we could hope for would be the full control and even then it would be so close to having a 'cure' that it's highly unlikely. Rats. Think they'll ever get someone with a coolness factor on the show again?

[> [> Um...isn't there another Part? -- Darby, 06:38:24 01/13/03 Mon

Maybe I'm thickheaded (and no, we're not putting it to a vote), but I'm not sure what the actual point is here. It's a very comprehensive trip down memory lane, but the only real assertion that comes across to me is in the title.

I'm honestly not trying to be snarky, as you've obviously put a huge amount of work in here...I'm just not sure you've left much for us to discuss.

[> [> [> Re: Um...isn't there another Part? -- LittleBit, 08:03:47 01/13/03 Mon

Not really sure what to say here. Except that I guess maybe this isn't the place for a post of this nature.

[> [> [> [> Littlebit and Darby -- Tchaikovsky, 09:30:08 01/13/03 Mon

Not only is this post a good way of making the apparent disconnectedness of some of the Season Four episodes resurface in the heads of people on the board, it also makes interesting and valid points about several of the episodes, as well as coming to some conclusions about the patterns of the Season as a whole. For example, I was interested by the assertion that Xander is incapable of understanding body language, and in the conclusions about the humanising of many of the villains, coupled with many of the villains' attempt to deny communication [as most obviously, but not uniquely, with the Gentlemen.]


If I was worried about the appropriateness of my posts, I'd never post anything substantial, as I have an annoying tendency to spout thousands of entirely non-Buffy related 'words of wisdom'. Littlebit's post stays on topic throughout.

I am willing to accept that there are different types of post, and that maybe a more orthodox one is one which either draws a controversial conclusion or offers a question to the board, but not to accept that some kinds of posts shouldn't be posted, [except trolling, and a long unprompted essay on the anatomy of haddock, which I sadly didn't bring myself to post].

I found this interesting and stimulating, and don't think any kind of post should be branded inappropriate.

TCH

[> [> [> [> [> But... -- Darby, 11:02:57 01/13/03 Mon

I never meant to suggest that it was inappropriate. Since the title seemed to suggest a theme, I really thought that I was reading an exposition that got so extensive that LB might have not realized that she had not gotten back to it. I see similar things happen in papers that people write. Then LB responded and I wasn't sure what to say - TCH, your addition helped form my response.

But I also wanted to point out that, except for the occasional viewpoints sprinkled into the recaps, there wasn't much to discuss for us readers out here. I don't think that this makes the post inappropriate, but often this sort of post receives few responses (I assume that my occasional stream-of-consciousness reviews have the same problem, or at least my ego is happy believing it) just for that reason, and I imagine the writers sitting at their keyboards wondering why no one seems to be reading what they've put up. That's the second reason why I responded the way I did. I kinda knew that it was risky, but I also knew how frustrating getting little obvious response after putting this much effort into a post can be. It was meant to be a constructive criticism, but there was no way to do that without being a smidge critical. I really regret if I've hurt any feelings.

- Darby, scurrying back under his rock.

[> [> [> [> [> [> Maybe... -- LittleBit, 11:44:09 01/13/03 Mon

... it has to do with the fact that this is part four of a six (now to be seven) part series, the first three of which were posted last summer? This post focused only on season 4; each of the parts is focused on a single season. Simple evil started in Part 1 and the journey that evil takes will continue until Part 6 (Pogo) and beyond. Perhaps what I should have done was indicate this at the beginning of the post, but I honestly didn't think of that. The first three were close enough together for the concept to make itself clear, and there was a significant gap between those and the current one, but the possible impact of that time gap never even occurred to me.

I do know that far more people read posts like this than respond to them (quite often, I hear from them in chat). Part of the joke regarding the "archived by noon" comment was that immediately after I posted Part One, shadowkat posted her wonderful Spike/Willow's journey and immediately after Part Two, the haiku thread was posted (there were skidmarks to show how fast mine went out after that one)...and my impeccable timing totally amused me.

As for my initial response, I really didn't know how to take your comments. TCH's response, and your follow-up have really helped to clarify it for me. There's no hurt feelings (okay, maybe a little teensy one right here [points] but it's all better now). I know this isn't the kind of post that invites a great deal of discussion, but I'm not sure how to do that and cover an exposition/analysis of all the specific evils in a season.

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> One more (quick) thought -- Tchaikovsky, 12:01:03 01/13/03 Mon

Being such a mammoth and comprehensive series, (at least by the time it is finished), do you think it might be worth asking Sol is she would put it up in the Existential Scoobies somewhere? Then, rather than being an unusual post, it could be a massive seven season treatise on the developing nature of evil in the Buffyverse, and I'm sure it would sit there as comfortably, especially without the risk of being immediately swallowed by Voy.

TCH

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: That's my plan :-) -- LittleBit (who finally got the first three coded for the FC), 12:04:26 01/13/03 Mon


[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Re: Maybe... -- shadowkat, 12:21:22 01/13/03 Mon

Sorry about that...on posting my essay at the same time.
If it helps the same thing has happened to me. The dang meme threads sent one of my essay posts to archive quicker than I wished.

But you hit on something interesting here - truth is it's hard for people to respond to essays. Some do. But some - I remember Phoenix once telling me that the reason she didn't respond was she couldn't think of anything worthwhile to say and was afraid of detracting from the post. I know I don't respond to some posts for the same reasons, afraid of detracting when the poster said it so well. I guess a wow would be good enough.

Hence what I would put here. Wow. I printed off the first three as well and read them. I find them fascinating.
And since I agree with your points - don't tend to respond.
(Another thing - I think lots of folks on the board only post a response if they disagree with something...just a guess.)

SK

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> LOL ... don't be sorry! -- LittleBit, 14:19:11 01/13/03 Mon

I just thought it got to be funny. And thanks for the Wow!

[> [> [> [> [> completely agree. -- shadowkat, 12:13:11 01/13/03 Mon

Little Bit - please keep posting these. If we can handle off topic threads - we can do this.

And obviously - someone found something to discuss - Sophist posted something below. And I printed off these posts as well your past one's in this series. I'm looking forward to seeing you do Season 5 and 6.

SK

[> [> Great work LittleBit! -- ponygirl, 08:42:34 01/13/03 Mon


[> [> Great job!! And a dissent on Willow (you knew I would). -- Sophist, 09:17:54 01/13/03 Mon

My post pretty well guarantees you lose your bet (assuming you meant EST).

Willow uses her power as a witch for the first time in a completely selfish manner, giving us a glimpse into just how far she considers going in the name of vengeance when she's feeling hurt, and also how recklessly she is willing to use magic. She begins and very nearly completes a spell to curse Oz and Veruca

Your second sentence contradicts the first clause of the first one. She did not actually use her power in such a manner. She considered it, but couldn't bring herself to do it.

Willow showed herself as being capable of self-absorption to the extent of wanting everyone else around her to wallow with her in her self-pity.

I assume by this you mean her sadness at Oz's departure. If so, I don't think this is fair; in fact, her friends, especially Buffy, were not fair. Compare W/O to B/P:

Buffy slept with Parker in HLOD and then was distraught about it for 2 episodes, plus some random comments in a couple of later episodes. Willow lost Oz (a far more serious event, IMHO) in WaH, and then was distraught for 3 episodes, after which we never hear about it again. There is very little difference between the 2 situations, which are clearly intended to parallel each other. Willow was no more self-absorbed than Buffy, even on this comparison.

The true comparison, however, is not to B/P, but to B/A. If we make that comparison, Willow certainly grieved much less for Oz than Buffy did for Angel (a fact which someone here will be sure to twist into a criticism of Willow!). In no way is it fair to say Willow was self-absorbed.

[> [> [> Re: Great job!! And a dissent on Willow (you knew I would). -- Dochawk, 12:25:27 01/13/03 Mon

Soph I definitely agree with your thoughts on Willow.

As fans we have a propensity to criticize our characters when ME is metaphorically dealing with issues in relationships that we all deal with in our growing up years. This extends to all of the sexual relationships (especially those discussed in the long thread below) and for Willow here. The reactions we see aren't abnnormal for the way many of us have grown up, but they are of course dramatized tomake good tv. I doubt we would fault our friends when we were 20 when they pined for their ex for 3 weeks after the breakup of what they thought was their once in a lifetime love. And Willow tempted by the dark side (by using the spells) is just a metaphor with how many of us dealt with these relationships. And of course ME is always going to go for the pain, we watch the show because of it, yet criticize them for the way we interpet it afterwards. What an impossible double edged sword for ME to have to face.

[> [> [> Re: yes, I surely did -- LittleBit ((Best 25¢ I ever lost ;-) ... ), 13:42:59 01/13/03 Mon

Before I say anything more ... this is not Willow-bashing. She's one of the most interesting and complex characters on the show, second only to Buffy in my opinion. Both Willow and Buffy have tremendous power at their disposal - and both struggle with the morality of that power. I will try to keep comparisons between the two to a minimum.

I wasn't even really considering Buffy/Parker any more than I was thinking of Willow/Moloch. The only comparable relationship Buffy had to Willow/Oz was Angel.

What I was trying to express was that when Willow was at her lowest points, first with anger, then with grief, she tends to act rather than withdraw. When Buffy talks to her after she has seen Oz and Veruca, Buffy tells her that it is not her fault, that she should put the blame where it belongs. In her anger, Willow puts the blame on those she feels have betrayed her ... Oz and Veruca. She decides to act ... and begins a spell that would put a very nasty curse on each of them. While she does not go through with it, I believe she frightened herself with the strength of her desire for revenge, and with how close she came to going through with it. Under the circumstances, I do feel that she determined to use her power in a selfish way. She didn't scream this curse at them when she found them, she (most likely) researched the spell, went to a lab, gathered materials, performed the incantation, and had reached the final step before she realized what she was doing and stopped. Yes, she stopped, but her active response to the anger and hurt was to decide to place a curse on them. And when she is bemoaning the fact that her 'will be done' spell didn't work, she describes the stopping as not having the guts to do the spell on Veruca (apparently having forgotten that the spell included Oz as well).

Later, when the finality of Oz's departure is brought home to her, Willow gets very upset, more so than when he left in the first place. Because now she knows he's not coming back. She tries to erase the pain by making her sorrows wade in light beer. Her friends let her know that's not the way to go, and Buffy insists on getting her back to the dorm. Willow tells her she just wants the pain to be over, to go away just because she says so; she wants to make it go 'poof'. Buffy tells her it going to take time, that she just has too go through the pain. Which Buffy did, all three times she lost Angel, including having to make the decision to kill him when he was evil, and again having to make that decision right after his soul is restored. Willow simply doesn't want to wait. She waits until Buffy is asleep, then performs a spell that she thinks should allow her to will the pain away. My describing her as self-absorbed has to do with most of the inadvertent damage she does during the time her spell is in effect. She curses Giles with blindness because he was concerned that she was not acting like herself, and he had the nerve to tell her that she shouldn't be doing solo magic while her energy is unfocused. She's angry at Buffy because Buffy can't spend time with her when she wants because Buffy needs to go find Spike. Willow goes to Xander for validation, and instead he offers reason and explanation. Her peevishness at this comes close to killing them all. It's not until d'Hoffryn tells her what chaos she has created that she is even cognizant of the effects of her spell. She's appalled and quickly reverses it.

I do think it's fair to say that Willow was self-absorbed at this point in time. Just as it would be fair to say that Buffy was self-absorbed when she ran away after sending Angel to a hell dimension. I do think that she turned to magic both times as quick ways to make her feel better, whether or not she completed it. These aspects of Willow's character are some of the things that make her multi-faceted and intriguing. These are flaws that we want to see her recognize and work through, coming out a stronger person for having faced them.

[> [> [> [> Re: yes, I surely did -- Sophist, 17:14:46 01/13/03 Mon

My first point was even narrower than that. Your original sentence said that Willow "used" magic. I was objecting only on the ground that she started to, but didn't carry through. Therefore she didn't "use" it. I wasn't commenting on anything other than this narrow point.

On the self-absorbtion issue, we may just be differing on how broad the term is. To me, "self-absorbed" is Cordy in the early eps of S1. I would never apply that term to Buffy or Willow at any time until maybe S6 (and perhaps not then).

The reason I wouldn't in S4 is that they both had legitimate grounds for sorrow. It's pretty easy for outsiders to dismiss another's pain; all the more reason why we should be charitable to those who suffer. I'm not ready to say that either Buffy or Willow let it go on too long.

Doc's point is well-taken. ME had a point to make: don't dwell on your losses. They chose Buffy and Willow to make that point. That doesn't mean that we, from the outside, can't reach a different conclusion. I would in both cases.

[> [> [> [> [> self-absorption -- Flo, 00:57:22 01/14/03 Tue

I agree that the battle for who is most self-absorbed isn't really the issue here. Buffy and Willow can both have their "Cordelia moments." What is interesting to me is the way Willow requires that her friends demonstrate that they feel what she is feeling. Buffy, when she was swept into her own insecurity over Parker, talked on and on about what she was feeling. She expected her friends to listen, but she didn't expect them to feel miserable, too. In fact, she was so narcissistic through her Parker process that she really wasn't paying much attention at all to how her friends were responding.

Willow, on the other hand, feels angry at and disappointed in Buffy when Buffy leaves the room to find Spike rather than sit and wallow with Willow. Then, when Buffy is not available for her, she goes to Xander and tries to extract sympathy from him. It is as if she is so afraid to fully own and experience her own grief that she must put it on others in order to make it better.

[> [> [> Excellent post, LittleBit! And Sophist, I agree completely about Willow. -- Ixchel, 17:26:19 01/13/03 Mon


[> [> Fabulous. Thanks so much 'bit! -- Caroline, 12:49:58 01/13/03 Mon


[> LB's "Evolution of Evil" series is both on-topic and required reading -- cjl, 12:45:01 01/13/03 Mon

The gradual shift from the simple monsters of the week in S1 to the "monsters within" of S6 and beyond is worth noting in minute detail. Even if there isn't much in the way of analysis, seeing it all on screen, season-by-season, is a way to reflect on aspects of evil you've forgotten or didn't think related to the overall theme of a season.

But, to throw a bone out to Darby, a little more analysis would be welcome. Your observation about Xander's complete inability to read body language in "Hush" was a sharp observation, and I'd like to see more of the same.

Great news for Lorne fans! (only backstage spoilers; no story spoilers) -- Rob, 09:31:32 01/13/03 Mon

http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/art-main.html?2003-01/13/12.30.tv

"Andy Hallett, who plays green-skinned Lorne on The WB's Angel, told SCI FI Wire that he's becoming a regular cast member, starting with the vampire series' upcoming 14th episode. "They just announced it two days ago," Hallett said in an interview Jan. 11 during the network's winter press preview. "So you'll be seeing more of Lorne, which I never expected, by the way." Hallett, who had only been a recurring player, will also appear in revamped credits opening the show.

Hallett added, "I was originally signed on for, like, two episodes at the very beginning. And yesterday or the day before was my 48th episode. And then I got a wonderful call from [series co-creator] Joss Whedon, ... and I was absolutely stunned. He caught me totally off guard. And he said, 'I want to let you know that we're making you a regular for the back nine episodes of this season.' ... They've been using me a lot anyway, so I kind of anticipated being with them for the duration, but I really wasn't sure. So this just really solidified it." Angel airs Wednesdays at 9 p.m. ET/PT and returns with new episodes Jan. 15."

_________________________

Oh, and didja hear that AD and AH are engaged?!? Awww! :o)

Rob

[> Woops, got beat -- JM, 09:45:17 01/13/03 Mon

Didn't see your post already about Alexis and Aly.

Great to hear about Lorne. Can't think of anyone who doesn't love him.

[> Very cool! I'm happy for our little green kiwi tart! -- Dichotomy, 09:49:08 01/13/03 Mon

My lame attempt at a Lornesque term of endearment--sorry.

[> [> Re: Very cool! I'm happy for our little green kiwi tart! -- slain, 12:55:58 01/13/03 Mon

To me a "kiwi tart" would be a loose woman from New Zealand, but that's just me.

I'm glad Lorne has been made a regular - all the best new regular characters have been recurring characters who've stayed on, as opposed to characters created to be regulars (does this make sense?), and he's earned his place. Mind you, whenever I see him on the show, I often think "God, how can he stand being put in all that makeup every day?". Though I guess it's probably no more than many TV anchors wear.

[> [> [> They use make up on Lorne? -- DickBD, 14:48:16 01/13/03 Mon

Wouldn't it be easier to just find someone that looked the part? ;)

[> [> [> [> Re: Hey, it ain't easy being green, but sometimes the magic works -- Brian, 16:15:04 01/13/03 Mon


[> A splash of cold water on this happy occasion for Lorne fans -- cjl (Lornepalooza host, who's risking charges of heresy...), 13:24:18 01/13/03 Mon

Two simple words:

Cast bloat.

As much as I love the idea of the green guy as a regular (and when is he reopening the Hyperion ballroom as the new Caritas, anyway?), we're in danger of expanding the cast to Buffy-sized proportions. After a first season of DB, CC, and GQ/AD as the regulars and a galaxy of top notch supporting characters, we now have DB, CC, AD, JAR, AA, VK, and now AHal as regulars, and a rapidly diminishing supporting cast.

I'd love to laugh off the expanding cast size as a minor challenge for the talented writers of ME, but judging from Buffy S7, they're not as adept at juggling jumbo sized casts as we might think. (Anybody out there satisfied with Giles' screen time? OK, he's not a regular anymore. How about Anya's? Dawn's? Willow's? Xander's?)


As much as it hurts to say this, some of these characters need to be either eliminated or reduced to recurring status. Once they've cleared up the mystery of his birth and his connection to the Beast, should Connor be a regular? Wouldn't it be better for him to strike out on his own and visit when the writers have some juicy father/son angst for DB and VK to chew on? If Fred and Gunn split up, is there enough interest in their characters (by the writers or the audience) to keep them in the show 24/7? Wouldn't Gunn/JAR be better off as an independent operative, out from under Angel's orbit? No, not with a street gang like in S1, but maybe switching places with Wes and leading a 21st century demon-hunting agency, combining his street smarts and the hi-tech wizardry he learned from Fred.

And as for Cordelia...no. It's too painful. I won't even suggest it.

So--congrats, Andy. You deserve regular status. But let's see if seven is a lucky number.

[> [> But then again... -- Rob, 13:42:01 01/13/03 Mon

...if Lorne is going to be on every episode, as he has been recently, he might as well be in the opening credits. He doesn't have much more screen time than Willow/Xander/Dawn lately.

Speaking of which, I do adore this season of "Buffy." But even I will admit that not enough time is being spent on the characters, for the past two episodes especially (although I will not say that I don't think there were any good character moments--they're just too few and far between, IMO). I never thought I'd say this, but I hope that there can be one or two standalone episodes coming up, before the final stretch of story-arc heavy eps, so that we can have a little time to just deal with the characters. Since it seems like we may be approaching the end of the series, and we only have about 10 eps left, I'm getting worried that there may not be enough time to answer all the questions of this season and have enough quality time with the characters whom we will miss so terribly when they're gone. I think a good character-driven (preferably Xander-driven) standalone episode is just what is needed about now.

I have faith (heh, heh) though that this can be rectified, and that the characters have been pushed aside lately precisely because of the need to kick the Big Bad arc into full gear. The first batch of episodes this year was chock full of character goodness. Lessons, Beneath You, STSP, Help, Selfless, Him, Conversations with Dead People, Sleeper, Never Leave Me were very character-heavy. It is only BotN and Showtime (which I still enjoyed, for the most part, by the way) that we've not been getting enough character-driven moments. It seems like it's been forever since we had the break, and these two eps were spaced out. I doubt we'd be feeling such a dramatic drop-off in character moments had we seen these episodes in a row.

Rob

Rob

[> [> [> Spoilery below (but only in the most obtuse way) -- Sergio, 16:38:04 01/13/03 Mon

From what we know, you should be getting your wish, both specifically and generally.

[> [> [> [> "for 9 back episodes..." ?Just seeing a little less firmness for future. -- BR (love Lorne! But....), 17:03:47 01/13/03 Mon


[> [> [> [> [> The deal with "back" episodes... -- Rob, 19:04:46 01/13/03 Mon

There are 15 episodes left of "Angel" this year, since only 7 aired before winter break.

During the upcoming sweeps, there will be 6 episodes in a row, in which Andy' s name will not appear in the credits.

And then, in time for the next sweeps period there are the 9 final episodes of the season. And Andy's name will appear in those final 9. I assume that "back" just meant they'll be the last batch of the season.

Rob

[> [> [> I agree with you Rob Rob... -- Dichotomy, 17:28:03 01/13/03 Mon

It's time for a Xander-driven ep! I feel that somehow he's more important to the upcoming battle than serving as a skilled wall patcher and window boarder-upper. Mind you, it's just a general feeling I have that could probably be backed up with episodic evidence if I took the time to think it through. I've avoided the spoilers thus far (unlike last season), so it's not based on anything but a vibe I'm getting. But some of the Trollops are making it so hard to resist!

AH and AD -- JM, 09:32:02 01/13/03 Mon

Says at scifi.com that Alexis and Aly are an official (with a ring and a tentative date with the preacher) item since X-mas. Sigh . . . some hearts are breaking 'bout now.

[> Yippie! -- Masq, 09:42:28 01/13/03 Mon

I for one am happy for them. A marriage made on the Hellmouth...

[> Awww, that's so sweet. They are so cute together. -- deeva, 09:59:54 01/13/03 Mon


[> Prediction: One posted photo of AH in wedding dress and AD in groom's tux... -- cjl, reveling in the marital cuteness, 10:58:46 01/13/03 Mon

And the collective sigh will blow this entire board out of the internet.

Sniff. Love those crazy kids. Hope for long life and happiness on the Hellmouth that is Hollywood...

[> "some hearts are breaking 'bout now" - yeah, like mine -- Farstrider, 14:17:00 01/13/03 Mon


Vamps & ESP -- ZachsMind, 14:21:44 01/13/03 Mon

Riddle me this, Batman!

The Gift from season five. Willow telepathically orders Spike to go up to protect Dawnie. They definitely have a conversation. Since Willow has telepathy and Spike does not, she has to be able to read his mind in order to pick up his thoughts.

Rewind to Earshot in season three. Buffy tries to read Angel's mind with her newfound demony powers. He tells her that vampires can't have their minds read. "It's like the mirror. The thoughts are there, but they create no reflection in you."

So how did Willow read Spike's mind?

Other times Willow has used telepathy include the opening scene in Bargaining Part One, and most recently, in Showtime.

[> Re: Vamps & ESP -- KKC, 14:31:08 01/13/03 Mon

Actually, it's been observed that Spike had to speak out loud for Willow to hear him. In fact, he's shouting quite loudly, to the confusion of the other characters around him. The implication is that Spike can receive telepathic speech, but not project it. So if you get really lawyerly about the continuity, there is no inconsistency. :)

-KKC

[> [> Okay fine so I make a bad Riddler. =) thanks! -- ZachsMind, 15:57:42 01/13/03 Mon


Buffy cancelled? -- botitas, 14:46:12 01/13/03 Mon

CNN is reporting that UPN will not be picking up Buffy for next season. Has anyone heard any information to contary.

[> I don't know about CNN but thats not what Les Moonves said 2 days ago -- Dochawk, 15:29:45 01/13/03 Mon

New York Daily News - http://www.nydailynews.com

Buffy's future is at stake

Monday, January 13th, 2003

HOLLYWOOD - A little bit of "Buffy" is better than none at all for UPN. "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" could return next season even if its star, Sarah Michelle Gellar, doesn't appear in every episode, CBS President Leslie Moonves, who also oversees UPN, told reporters yesterday at the television Critics winter press tour.

UPN is currently in talks with the show producer 20th Century Fox,about keeping the show for another season. "Buffy" was the first breakout hit for the WB Network. But UPN acquired the series last season, after the WB and Fox could not reach an agreement on a new license fee. Now it's UPN's turn to negotiate and the network is looking at a range of options since Gellar is not signed to the show beyond this season.

"One possibility is she comes back, one possibility is she comes back a couple of times, one possibility is we do a spinoff," Moonves said. "Another possibility is that we have a brand new show on Tuesday at 8 o'clock."

The future of "Buffy" is just one of the challenges UPN executives face as they decide what the 8-year-old network should be. While the focus is on viewers between 18 and 34, the network's personality changes nightly - sitcoms with black casts Monday, "Buffy" Tuesday sci-fi with "Enterprise" Wednesday, wrestling Thursday and action
movies Friday.

After surging with the addition of "Buffy" and "Enterprise" last year, UPN's ratings have lagged this season, with the WB taking overfifth place in the prime-time ratings race.

Moonves said UPN, while still a money-loser, is in better financial shape than it has ever been. Growth targets include black viewers, who not only watch Monday but also tune into "Buffy" and "WWE Smackdown" in large numbers. Future UPN shows will have multi-cultural casts and more contemporary themes, said Moonves and UPN's entertainment president, Dawn Ostroff.

UPN is already headed in the direction, with the addition of the sitcom "Abby," which stars Sydney Tamiia Poitier, and "Platinum," a drama set in the world of hip-hop. The network has projects in the works from Will Smith and Jada Pinkett-Smith, and hip-hop artist Eve.

"Diversity is very important to this network," Moonves said. "I think we're serving an audience that is not really served by a lot of the other networks. I'd like us to continue along in that vein."

Stephen Battaglio

[> [> Moonves has been stating this party line since last December, as I posted from TV Guide. -- Briar Rose, 16:45:10 01/13/03 Mon

This is only about whether BtVS as we know it continues or not. Meaning will SMG even be involved or will they decide that even a spin off would't carry the weight without the draw of SMG.

I have always assumed that no full time SMG means canceling the show and will be agreed upon by all sides (UPN, ME, even most of the cast would probably agree) as the best move that could be made.

Sarah Michelle Gellar IS Buffy. Since the show is called Buffy the Vampire Slayer, it is only common sense that "Buffy" will be cancled if SMG isn't involved at all, and probably if she is only involved peripherally.

Contrary to what is sometimes stated in editorials about BtVS - this is not a "group show" where all characters are equal in their importance to the story being told. This show is wonderful for actors who want to spread their acting wings, for sure. It is filled with people who are terrific actors in their own right. I doubt any of them will be without employ for long in any case. But it is Buffy-centric, no matter how well the other characters have been allowed to be fleshed out and explored. It always comes back to Buffy - as it should.

The entire premise of BtVS is how this slip of a girl comes to town and changes the lives of all who come to know her as well as the force of energy of the Hell Mouth forever.

The character of Buffy is central to the entire Buffy-verse. Nothing happens in the series that isn't related to her existance in Sunnydale. It would be practically impossible for UPN not to cancel the series if SMG truly decides not to return in any way. Even as an SMG "special appearance" every once in a while show - it would still not be BUFFY the Vampire Slayer - it would be The Woman Formerly Known as Buffy The Vampire Slayer Visits the Lives of Her Buddies That Are Still Set in Sunnydale and Now Have Struggled On Without Her, But Still Hold Her and What She Did Strongly in Their Hearts....

That title won't fit on any screen I can think of.

[> Not on their web site--can you give the reference? -- Wisewoman, 16:31:03 01/13/03 Mon

Is it on the TV news?

[> [> The ? of SMG's contract negotiations should be answered by April at the latest. -- Briar Rose, 16:49:31 01/13/03 Mon


[> [> [> My bad. Sorry - thinking FEB and typed April... April is near end of filming season. -- BR, 16:52:23 01/13/03 Mon


[> Not on their web site--can you give the reference? -- Wisewoman, 16:32:22 01/13/03 Mon

Is it on the TV news?

[> [> Re: Not on their web site--can you give the reference? -- botitas, 17:32:03 01/13/03 Mon

CNN Headline News reported at 4:25 p.m. CST that Buffy was not going to be picked up for next season. However, I have not been able find any other reports, and have not been able to watch to see if they have repeated the story.

[> [> [> Thanks! And Welcome! -- dub ;o), 17:41:29 01/13/03 Mon


[> Buffy to Bite the Dust -- Rufus, 17:31:44 01/13/03 Mon

http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30500-1076368,00.html

BUFFY TO BITE THE DUST?


TV bosses plan to kill off cult show Buffy the Vampire Slayer following lacklustre ratings.

US station CBS said the long-running series, starring Sarah Michelle Gellar, is not expected to return for an eighth run.

Gellar, who is married to Scooby-Doo co-star Freddie Prinze Jr, is said to want to concentrate on her film career.

But CBS said the 25-year-old actress had "not said no" to reprising her role as the vampire killer.

There also may be a spin-off series featuring some of the other Buffy characters, it said.


Last Updated: 16:04 UK, Monday January 13, 2003

[> [> Re: Buffy to Bite the Dust -- Corwin of Amber, 19:14:10 01/13/03 Mon

Um, last I looked BTVS was shown on UPN, not CBS. Did CBS buy UPN and I just not hear about it, or what?

[> [> [> correcting myself -- Corwin of Amber, 19:20:23 01/13/03 Mon

I just did some googling. Apparently, CBS is the parent company of UPN. News to me.

[> [> [> Ditto to that piece of confusion...... -- AurraSing, 19:21:36 01/13/03 Mon

I've been hearing lots in the past wee bit about BTVS not being renewed,but I'm curious to hear exactly why CBS would be commenting about a FOX produced show that runs on UPN.

"Veddy curious.Veddy curious indeed!"

[> [> [> [> So "Dad" is already said no?? -- AurraSing, 19:27:41 01/13/03 Mon

Oh,that can't be good.

[> [> The rights of the editor (or the person who wrote this editorialized an interview) -- Dochawk, 23:18:16 01/13/03 Mon

I'm going to make you feel better (or maybe I'm not)but see above interview. Les Moonves and Dawn Ostroff haven't made a decision because SMG hasn't made a decision. The person who wrote this article took the LM/DO interview (that was quoted extensively above) and took bits and pieces (some of which had nothing to do with each other) to make it seem like a decision has been made. NOTHING is different than 2 months ago. The first decision is Joss to see if he has a storyline he wants to do and then to see if SMG is willing to do it. If Joss and Sarah want to come back you can be sure UPN will grab it. So don't go getting upset quite yet (doesn't mean that it will happen, but there are no changes).

[> [> [> Re: The rights of the editor (or the person who wrote this editorialized an interview) -- Rufus, 01:07:35 01/14/03 Tue

What we will get while noone knows what is going on will be articles that are just variations on the same old information we have at the moment...which is nothing.

[> [> Reads a bit strangly -- Deb, 00:12:02 01/14/03 Tue

Cancelled because of poor ratings? BUT SMG might consider coming back OR there could be a spin-off? If they are dusting it because of bad ratings, why bother even discussing the other two options at this point?

Sometimes I think people want to turn the heat up under the pot to see if anything boils. . . Dark magic of networks.

[> Re: Buffy cancelled? -- Deb, 23:59:56 01/13/03 Mon

Oh, I'm looking up at the stars and they are all bleeding red together........Or perhaps its a migrain.

[> Its on Sky News as well. -- Helen, 06:02:40 01/14/03 Tue


[> Prepare for battle! -- ponygoyle, 13:09:23 01/14/03 Tue

My alter-ego was preparing a post about how we should send some positive mental energies down ME's way much as we were able to pool our brain power to send Wisewoman some snow last month(though sadly many people seem to have a poor sense of Canada's geography and dumped most of the order on Ontario). It was going to be all perky and possibly include a winky smiley face.

But screw that! First Firefly and now this nipping at the heels of BtVS and AtS? Are we just going to sit back and let the hounds of hell in charge of the networks pick off our shows one by one? I say no way! Since demons control the studios and networks who is better able to deal with them than other demons? And I'm not just talking lawyers.

Let us swoop down on these "contract negotiations" and rend our enemies limb from limb. We will offer the heads of the heads of UPN, WB and Fox to the Whedon! And he will praise us and make more shows and all will be well.

[> [> Demonic Must-See TV -- The Unclean, 13:34:03 01/14/03 Tue

Are you mad? Don't you understand what's happening? Did you miss the memo? (It's posted on the bulletin board in Honorificus' temple in the M'Fashnik dimension.) Our infiltration into the ranks of the human world's entertainment industry is now almost complete. We've started to eliminate any television programs advocating independent thought and warning the humans about the existence of demons. Farscape and Firefly were relatively easy, as they were marginal projects, albeit from extremely talented people. But Buffy and Angel have always been our main targets.

Do you want to ruin everything?

I look upon the landscape of American network television, and everywhere I turn I see our triumph. Jerry Springer, Jenny Jones, Fear Factor, The Bachelorette, Joe Millionaire, the Surreal Life, and dozens of other programs designed to satisfy the human desire for connection with "reality" and the desire to feel superior to the idiots on screen; "Hidden Hills," "Good Morning Miami," "Abby," and dozens of other sitcoms, human interaction drained of any spontaneity or wit. Franchised ensemble dramas (Trek, CSI, L&O). Overextended former hits ("West Wing," "Drew Carey"). Joyless and existing only to produce money.

Ahh, it's music to my cauliflower-shaped ears.

So, demon-spawn, stop complaining and get to work on the last phase of our plan. Even after we've driven the Whedon creature off television, there are still wellsprings of creativity to squash. This "Abrams" character is having too much fun with "Alias." "24" might not be a one-season gimmick show. And we must eliminate "Larry David" once and for all....

[> [> [> Man, that's just... evil -- ponygoyle, 13:47:40 01/14/03 Tue

which I appreciate 'cause you know evil-- but call me old-fashioned I just don't have any patience for all these subtle manipulations and power behind the throne thingies. I like a battle I can sink my teeth into, preferably the jugular area.

And if your plan is working so well how do you explain the cancellation of Touched By An Angel, aka The Source of All Evil?

[> [> [> [> We're not supposed to say this where any humans might actually be listening, but.... -- The Unclean, 14:04:30 01/14/03 Tue

Touched By An Angel was REAL. Most angels really are that bland and boring. Ask Cordelia.

We enjoyed the fact that "TBaA" never honestly explored the grey areas between good and evil like BUFFY and ANGEL do, but--it had to go.

Same principle applied to "Highway to Heaven"....

Scenes Not Heard - Scoobies & Body Language -- ZachsMind, 15:51:26 01/13/03 Mon

The following is in response to cjl's response to Darby's response to Little Bit's "Evolution of Evil." Since this post goes off topic, I thought I'd start a new thread.

"...But, to throw a bone out to Darby, a little more analysis would be welcome. Your observation about Xander's complete inability to read body language in 'Hush' was a sharp observation, and I'd like to see more of the same."

This sounds too much like fun. Can't help but give it a go myself.


Scenes Not Heard - use of body language in HUSH

"Can't even shout. Can't even cry.
The gentlemen are coming by.
Looking in windows. Knocking on doors.
They need to take seven and they might take yours.
Can't call to mom. Can't say a word.
You're gonna die screaming but you won't be heard"



It's ironic that the first time we see Tara (performed admirably by Amber Benson) is in Hush. She's a quiet sort, who stutters, and particularly in her first year spoke more through subtle actions then she did with words. Yet there were times when the slightest peep from her had serious repercussions. In "Family" Tara put a spell on her friends for fear they would learn she was a demon. She punctuated her spell with a nonverbal blowing of dust from her hand. When Tara was mad from Glory's powers, a mere look at Dawn & a slip of the tongue was all it took for Glory's season long search to be at an end. Tara was in a quiet way the most powerful of Scoobies when it came to body language. She could tell before anyone else when something was wrong. Second only to Giles, Tara stood up against Willow when she sensed Willow's use of magic would be her undoing. Tara quietly sat there by Buffy's side after Joyce's passing, and gave quiet comfort to the Slayer when no one else could. Tara read Spike's body language during the episode "Trapped" when Buffy had decided to try and go cold turkey from his affections, communicating both verbally & nonverbally to Spike in ways that kept the secret safe but made things clear with Spike where Tara stood. There were things about Tara we knew without her having to make a speech about them. We understood her loyalties and her dislikes. Much of this is to the credit of Amber Benson's exceptional acting talents - for she was able to put on the screen things that no writer could put on a page, while still being true to the material given.

When we first see her in Hush, her body language tells us volumes. She's not quick to speak up for herself. Her demeanor lacks self-confidence and certainty. She appears to have mostly gone through life seen and not heard. She let others speak on her behalf. She also seems to have quite a bit of fear behind those eyes, like a skittish but adorable little bunny rabbit who has had one too many brushes with noisy cars on county roads. What we don't learn in this first encounter is that the very concept of Tara attending college was an act of defiance against her upbringing. Only recently had she begun to take a stand for herself, and was uncertain with her newfound place in the world, like a newly born fawn just getting her legs underneath her. However, that too can be sensed from Benson's early performances.

Second perhaps only to Buffy in this episode, Tara herself has the most physical action of the episode. She fashions a plan for survival without any outside input. She puts it into action by collecting her magic books and rushing towards Willow's dorm room. On the way there, she is confronted by The Gentlemen, who chase Tara across the college campus and force her to run. This chase scene is slightly echoed later in the season when Oz learns Tara & Willow had by then become an item.

Rather haphazardly, Tara finally makes her destination. She runs into Willow, and together they continue the chase. Locking themselves inside a small room, with only a heavy soda machine to keep the fae at bay, they attempt to conventionally move the machine to the door. Willow noticeably twists her ankle and falls to the floor. Tara runs to her side.

Now comes the single most effective nonverbal moment in all of Hush, and perhaps the entire series. Tara looks into Willow's eyes. They take hands. Then immediately both look towards the soda fountain and the door. With their accumulated power of magic, they telekinetically accomplish what their physical prowess could not, thus protecting themselves from their would-be captors. It's a powerful, compelling moment. In that instance their relationship seems destined and locked. Friends. Sisters. Lovers. Fated.

Never in any appearance of Tara throughout the series did Tara seem incapable of reading body language. She wasn't good when it came to words, but she could sense from what people didn't say in a room whether or not she was truly welcome. Her empathy seemed unparalleled. Benson projected simultaneously a respect and joy for life coupled with a perpetual melancholy. Not easy to do. Much of it was without words. She is to be commended.

Now, on the opposite side of this body language spectrum character-wise (but certainly not acting wise as they're both very talented) was the role of Xander in Hush, played of course by Nicholas Brendan. While Tara communicated as much or more with deeds as words, Xander's always been mostly the opposite, and when The Gentlemen stole their voices, Xander was like a fish out of water.

[I have more to say but have run out of time presently. Perhaps Darby or someone else can step in and do the compare and contrast of Xander's actions both in Hush and elsewhere throughout the series. There are many moments where to the audience a character's body language gave one thing away but Xander was oblivious to it. An inability to read body lanuage is a very telling and consistent aspect of Xander's character throughout the run of the series.]


[> Wonderful job on Tara -- Dochawk, 16:14:15 01/13/03 Mon

And I think AB used her body language to project her vulnerability even when people worried she was a demon in Family. Because even then, she had most of us empathizing with her.

The rest of the season on BtVS and AtS: **NO** spoilers -- Wisewoman, 16:25:27 01/13/03 Mon

Now, you all know what a Spoiler Trollop I am and always have been. The only thing I refrain (sp?) from these days is the wildfeeds; everything else is fair game.

In some ways this restricts the amount of posting I can do on this board, because it's impossible to comment on various speculation without revealing that you know what is (or isn't) going to happen. That's okay--I've come to terms with it.

But sometimes, like today, I just gotta say, Whoo Boy! I look at the panorama of the available spoilers and it's really exciting. There's some dynamite stuff comin' down the pike and I think we're all going to be surprised, intrigued, astonished, delighted, demented, and various other things by what the February sweeps period serves up. I wouldn't spoil anyone else for the world--I just want to tell you that it's going to be so interesting. Damn, I love these shows...

;o) dub

[> Thanks for the reassurance! -- Masq, the ever pure one, 16:59:21 01/13/03 Mon


[> Wisewoman, this is just what I wanted to hear! :) -- Ixchel, 17:01:51 01/13/03 Mon

Especially with all this talk about S7 being the last for BtVS. :(

Thanks for the care not to spoil, I swore off them last year when I found they seemed to, well, "spoil" the show for me just a bit. ;)

Ixchel

[> Can't wait! Don't know if I can! -- Dichotomy, 17:30:27 01/13/03 Mon

Dubdub, you're this close to sucking me back through to the Trollop board. I can hardly stand the suspense!

[> [> Don't want to lead you astray... -- dub, 17:35:29 01/13/03 Mon

There's no big news today specifically, so I really don't want to send you off to the Spoiler Dimension, it's just the totality of spoilers for both shows, taken together, so many outrageous things coming up...it almost makes me gaspy!!

;o)

[> I've reclaimed my Spoiler Virginity, but even so . . . -- HonorH, 18:31:45 01/13/03 Mon

I swore off everything except TV Guide blurbs and UPN's worse-than-useless previews at the beginning of the year. Now I'm thinking of giving up even those in order to get the maximum impact of eps as they air. Nonetheless, it's good to hear great stuff is coming down the pike. I'm totally jazzed about where the show is going, and if the back end of the season can keep up with the front end, we're in for one hell of a ride.

**Note: I swore off BtVS spoilers only. Thanks to my WB-impaired situation, I go whole hog for Angelic spoilers as I invariably am totally spoiled by the time I can get the eps anyway. And if the spoilers I've gotten for AtS are anywhere near the truth, things are going to be *very* interesting for the AI crew before the season is out.

[> Question for dubdub... -- Rob, 19:08:25 01/13/03 Mon

I'm being completely spoiler free this year, but I just have to ask you this.

Without giving any details, can you please just tell me if any spoilers indicate whether Xander is going to be having a larger part to play in the second half of the season?

Rob

[> [> Answer to Rob's question...so you know what it might be spoilery for... -- dub, 19:21:41 01/13/03 Mon

Nothing I have heard or seen indicates that, but nothing prevents it, either.

[> [> Answer for Rob.....yes -- Rufus, 21:51:24 01/13/03 Mon


[> About the "O" word -- Deb, 23:49:02 01/13/03 Mon

Hi Wisewoman. Long time, no hear.

"O" is for the outrageous.

I just need to know if my academic blubbering regarding "no shippiness" on Buffy between two blonds is incorrect. I kinda hope so. : ) Outrageously wrong would be good.

[> [> More "O" in dream -- Deb, 23:52:39 01/13/03 Mon

I just woke up, and I mean just woke up, from a dream where the last thing I saw was Cordillia stepping out of a limo (black of course) in a wedding dress. And, yes, it looked "O" expensive.

Jung might say I'm dreaming of me . . . . Jung is wrong sometimes.

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